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tjf76
12-23-2010, 11:28 PM
I just bought a 5h upper with 1/11 twist stamped on the barrel but how do I know if its the spec II chamber?

t_ridl
12-23-2010, 11:50 PM
I believe that their 1/11 twist barrel are SPC II chambers. Is there a SPC II stamped next to it twist?

tjf76
12-23-2010, 11:56 PM
No spec II stamped all it says is stag arms 6.8 spc 1/11

delta34
12-24-2010, 07:34 AM
I made sure it was spec II when i bought it. Here's a link to there web site http://www.stagarms.com/product_info.php?cPath=15_36&products_id=332

Chris

tjf76
12-24-2010, 08:25 AM
I wonder why Stag does not just stamp their barrels Spec II

ArtFWTx
12-24-2010, 11:41 AM
Stag uses SPC II chambers.

Ratdog68
12-24-2010, 12:54 PM
I wonder why Stag does not just stamp their barrels Spec II

That's a good question... so is the whole "why not just put the m4 ramps in and be done with it? Strange. My buddy's 5.56 runs like a Swiss watch and drives tacks... and, he's got the 5H model.

Topper Harley
12-24-2010, 07:25 PM
I've had my stag model 5 for about a year now and my barrel has SPCII stamped on it right next to 1/11

GS1000SN
12-24-2010, 11:57 PM
I have had mine about a year also.

It is stamped SPC 1/11.

It is really a 1/10 and I doubt it is really a SPEC II.

It was advertised as a SPEC II 1/11

Wish I had waited and bought something other than a Stag.

tjf76
12-25-2010, 01:42 AM
I emailed Stag Arms about this, will update post after they get back to me.

fdxpilot
12-25-2010, 04:13 AM
I would be more worried about whether your Stag will reliably feed any ammo first. I never got to the point of worrying about chamber spec and barrel twist, as I could never get mine to feed more than 2 or 3 rounds before it jammed .

fdxpilot
12-25-2010, 04:17 AM
.................

fdxpilot
12-25-2010, 04:19 AM
................

Obviously having browser problems

ArtFWTx
12-25-2010, 11:22 AM
................

Obviously having browser problems

More likely too many Holiday drinks! :a32:

nosaj750
12-25-2010, 11:49 AM
I just purchased a model 7 which has a spec 2 chamber with 1:11 twist and feeds everything just fine. Yours should have the spec2 chamber as well from what I've read.

Madcat
12-25-2010, 12:54 PM
I have a 5h that has never had any feed issues. Stag told me all their barrels are spc II. It would be nice to see proof other than thier word

tjf76
12-25-2010, 12:58 PM
I am going to buy a Bison Upper or one from AR Performance

http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?17734-Wts-Stag-Arms-5h-6.8SPC-Upper

constructor
12-25-2010, 04:49 PM
I have a 5h that has never had any feed issues. Stag told me all their barrels are spc II. It would be nice to see proof other than thier word

from someone on arfcom-
Quote-"The key words in STAGARMS response is "current ship".

ARP is correct that Stag has sent out 5H uppers that are marked 1/11 when they are actually a 1/10.

How do I know this? I have a 5H upper, ordered from Palmetto State Arms, that is stamped "STAG ARMS 6.8 SPC 1/11" that is in fact a 1/10

and chamber unknown. I have been trying to work up loads for my 6.8 and my velocities are running a good bit slower than what others

are getting with a SPEC II chamber 1/11barrel. I found the post on 68forums where someone mentioned the Stag twist. I pulled out my cleaning

rod, a tight patch, a sharpie marker and a yard stick and checked my barrel. Did it six times.... all one revolution of the cleaning rod with ten

inches of travel (1 in 10).

I contacted Stag on October 4th. After my long winded explanation to two different people, the second one (I think his name was David)

told me to ship it back. I asked for return shipping and the person I was speaking with promised me he would send me the return shipping label

before close of business on the 4th. I was not given any return authorization number nor any other information as to who's attention it should

be directed. I did give my name, address, phone number and e-mail address. Today is October 22 and I have received nothing.

Not Happy.

Someone that shoots only factory ammunition and never runs the load over a chronograph will never know what the twist is and will

never have the need to check it.

In 47 rounds through this upper I have had four failure to feeds. Two with SSA and two with my loads. All functioned fine as a

single shot.

To the people who have had good customer service, congratulations, not my experience."

So what do you think of a comany that lies to their customers and thinks they are so stupid they would never check the twist rate of their barrels?
On the other hand I have heard they are accurate.

tjf76
12-25-2010, 05:11 PM
from someone on arfcom-
Quote-"The key words in STAGARMS response is "current ship".

ARP is correct that Stag has sent out 5H uppers that are marked 1/11 when they are actually a 1/10.

How do I know this? I have a 5H upper, ordered from Palmetto State Arms, that is stamped "STAG ARMS 6.8 SPC 1/11" that is in fact a 1/10

and chamber unknown. I have been trying to work up loads for my 6.8 and my velocities are running a good bit slower than what others

are getting with a SPEC II chamber 1/11barrel. I found the post on 68forums where someone mentioned the Stag twist. I pulled out my cleaning

rod, a tight patch, a sharpie marker and a yard stick and checked my barrel. Did it six times.... all one revolution of the cleaning rod with ten

inches of travel (1 in 10).

I contacted Stag on October 4th. After my long winded explanation to two different people, the second one (I think his name was David)

told me to ship it back. I asked for return shipping and the person I was speaking with promised me he would send me the return shipping label

before close of business on the 4th. I was not given any return authorization number nor any other information as to who's attention it should

be directed. I did give my name, address, phone number and e-mail address. Today is October 22 and I have received nothing.

Not Happy.

Someone that shoots only factory ammunition and never runs the load over a chronograph will never know what the twist is and will

never have the need to check it.

In 47 rounds through this upper I have had four failure to feeds. Two with SSA and two with my loads. All functioned fine as a

single shot.

To the people who have had good customer service, congratulations, not my experience."

So what do you think of a comany that lies to their customers and thinks they are so stupid they would never check the twist rate of their barrels?
On the other hand I have heard they are accurate.

All I can say is WOW!

GS1000SN
12-26-2010, 12:02 AM
The post from ARFCOM is mine (same screen name). The last statement on that post is not by me nor do I know where it came from.

To follow up, I called Stag again the first week of November and did speak with a David.

I had still not received any return information or pick-up call tag.

He did say he would take my information again and send another pick-up.

I asked if he would send me another upper with return shipping for the one I had and he said no way.

I put him off and said I would have to decide what I would do with the one I had. After all the bad things I have read on Stag I don't know what to do. I have considered just finding a barrel and change this one out but I have paid for something I did not get.

I have procrastinated on this hoping Stag would correct all the shortcomings and I could get an improved product.

It really makes me mad they advertised a SPEC II with a 1 in 11 twist, marked the barrel as a 1 in 11 but I got a 1 in 10. Maybe their barrel supplier screwed them but they didn't check. Stag was aware of the 1 in 10 problem when I called. I have e-mailed them asking if they use the SPEC II chamber and their reply was that they do use the SPEC II chamber. My barrel is only marked SPC so I don't know if it is really a SPEC II. I have not seen any signs of pressure problems at this point but I have not pushed my loads after discovering my twist rate.

First I tried the Remington 115 FMJ's and I did order some Sierra 90 gr. HP's (#1800) to see if I could get some better speeds from them. I am not seeing pressure signs on the few I have shot, just falling behind on the speeds people are getting from like loadings. I know all barrels are different and what you get from one is not necessarily what another will produce. I have not pushed them. I am using Remington brass and AA2230 powder.

Upper sits in my closet.

I will repeat I am dragging my feet on returning the upper. If I had received the return shipping from my initial call, the upper would have been returned then.

The last statement on that original post is not by me and I do not know where it came from.

constructor
12-26-2010, 01:19 AM
The post from ARFCOM is mine (same screen name). The last statement on that post is not by me nor do I know where it came from.

To follow up, I called Stag again the first week of November and did speak with a David.

I had still not received any return information or pick-up call tag.

He did say he would take my information again and send another pick-up.

I asked if he would send me another upper with return shipping for the one I had and he said no way.

I put him off and said I would have to decide what I would do with the one I had. After all the bad things I have read on Stag I don't know what to do. I have considered just finding a barrel and change this one out but I have paid for something I did not get.

I have procrastinated on this hoping Stag would correct all the shortcomings and I could get an improved product.

It really makes me mad they advertised a SPEC II with a 1 in 11 twist, marked the barrel as a 1 in 11 but I got a 1 in 10. Maybe their barrel supplier screwed them but they didn't check. Stag was aware of the 1 in 10 problem when I called. I have e-mailed them asking if they use the SPEC II chamber and their reply was that they do use the SPEC II chamber. My barrel is only marked SPC so I don't know if it is really a SPEC II. I have not seen any signs of pressure problems at this point but I have not pushed my loads after discovering my twist rate.

First I tried the Remington 115 FMJ's and I did order some Sierra 90 gr. HP's (#1800) to see if I could get some better speeds from them. I am not seeing pressure signs on the few I have shot, just falling behind on the speeds people are getting from like loadings. I know all barrels are different and what you get from one is not necessarily what another will produce. I have not pushed them. I am using Remington brass and AA2230 powder.

Upper sits in my closet.

I will repeat I am dragging my feet on returning the upper. If I had received the return shipping from my initial call, the upper would have been returned then.

The last statement on that original post is not by me and I do not know where it came from.

Notice it is outside the quote marks?
The guy at CMT(Stags parent company) said they make their own barrels and with a foreign accent he said "we do not need anyone to make parts for us"

Robby
12-26-2010, 10:49 AM
My Stag barrel is marked Stag Arms 6.8SPC 1/11 Now I am a trusting sole and I believe them. When I came to this site, and read about the pressure differences, I called them to verify that it is indeed, Spec II, 1/11. The fellow says that it is indeed, SPEC II, 1/11. After reading THIS thread, The words of Ronald Reagan rose from the depths, and screamed to my consciousness, "Trust, But Verify", so I did. Well, I did the cleaning rod and tape thing about twenty times and it keeps coming out 1/10, another ten or so times and, yes indeed 1/10. So now I think it is probably safe to assume that it is NOT a SPEC II chambering as well. I like this gun, BUT, I hate being lied to in vastly different numbers than my liking this gun. I am so outraged, and am glad it is Sunday, and I have a day to cool down. This is more than just a simple lie, although that in ITSeffenSELF is bad enough, There are safety issues. I have just about enough brass, to where I am going to start reloading. Of course I would do some experimenting. But even if I didn't reload, the higher pressure ammo is available from SSA. Outward appearance, they look the same. Am I missing something? WTF!!!
Robby

GS1000SN
12-26-2010, 11:24 AM
Constructor,

Yes, I did notice there were quote marks and the last comment was outside them. (very small quote marks)

I just wanted to clarify that that was not by me. I have read on the internet for some time now and I do know a lot of comments are given credit to the wrong people.

I also know the last comment was not yours.

It is interesting to know Stag (CMT) builds their barrels in house. This makes me wonder if they had some early production barrels (1 in 10) that wandered on to stamping machine after they changed to 1 in 11. If these early production barrels had been chromed line I can't help but wonder what chamber they have and when they swapped to the SPEC II. In other words, did they go to a SPEC II chamber before they changed to the 1 in 11 twist or did both the changes come about at the same time? Like I have posted, my barrel is only marked SPC 1/11. I believe others have said theirs have SPEC II 1/11. I wonder what the twist on those are?

I do wish more people with 5H 6.8's would check their twist rates.

As I have said in my original post, if you shoot only factory ammunition and do not run it over a chronograph you will never know and should never see a pressure problem unless factories start pushing the "combat" load pressures. As the cartridge progresses the only chambers that may take the faster loads may be constructor's (ARP's) 6.8x43 chamber.

I do like the 6.8 cartridge but I am stalled at the moment due to my indecision. This is my experience only.

If you have a 5H 6.8..... please check your twist.

Robby
12-26-2010, 12:51 PM
GS1000SN, Its always easy to misinterpret ones intention on the internet. You say, "wandered on to the stamping machine." Like there isn't intent there. There is no way for me to believe that this could anything but intentional, maybe in a toy factory, but not an arms maker. If things are so lax, that this is a mistake, then lord only knows what other issues lurk in the heart of these guns. SSA sells "TACTICAL" loads. Aren't these of a higher pressure than their standard loads. There is a difference. Would you bet the future of your company, that there is no functional difference? There is an old saying "If you see a mouse in the house, there's a dozen". In a legal sense, if someone is caught in a lie, the court is legally obligated to view all they say with jaundiced eye. Maybe I'll see things different after I have cooled down, but for right now, I'm pissed off and my blood is up!
Robby

chickasaw_hunter
12-26-2010, 01:19 PM
I had a 5H for a short time. I had big time accuracy problems, but no function problems. It is frustrating to get a new rifle and it not work. I'm sure my barrel had a bad spot in the rifling. I called Stag and they sent me the label to return it on their dime. I was a little angry too, who wouldn't be? Some of you sound like you're very angry. I found it best not to demonstrate my anger or resort to any name calling. I'll assume you didn't either. I also decided I needed to give Stag the chance to do the right thing, they couldn't do that if I didn't send the upper back to them. So I did, I had the upper back in two weeks. I would have had it back in a week, but I asked Stag if they would convert my 5H into a 7H and they needed to wait a couple of days for the 7H barrel. I believe that if you send the rifle back to Stag with the complaint that it is a 1/10 and not as represented as a 1/11 and not a Spec II chamber as represented and they have the opportunity to make it right and don't then you have a big complaint. Actually, you have what might amount to a criminal complaint, if it moved thru the mail. If not then you can go to the consumer protection division of your Attorney General's office, the Better Business Bureau, lots of stuff you can do. I know I had a Dell Computer, I gave them a chance to make it right, they didn't, until I went on a letter campaign and after I got a call from the Texas Attorney General's office, Dell decided to make it right with me, they were later prosecuted for some of their business practices. So if Stag is in fact lying to you, you have some recourse. So it looks like you've got two choices, send it back to Stag and give them a chance to do the right thing, or put it up for sale and stick someone else with a rifle that you believe is inferior and not up to proper spec's. I'm pretty sure if ARP had a customer that was unhappy they would much rather the customer send it back so they could inspect it and have the opportunity to make a happy customer. I think you otta send it back and give them a chance to do what's right. If there is lots of other 1/10 marked 1/11 Stag barrels out there they all otta get sent back. CH

Ratdog68
12-26-2010, 01:24 PM
M'be it is a bold faced lie... m'be it's a miscommunication/oversight. In either case... if the product is handled that "loosely", it does cause one to pause and wonder where else in "the process" their product is passed along without double checking. It's great to see the accuracy of a Stag Arms barrel... but, when you're finding incorrectly stamped barrels, a refusal to address a need for m4 feedramps when there's feeding issues with a more than the "rare" gun, and stampings on barrels which imply SAAMI, but claims of SPCII specs... it doesn't instill confidence in the offering as a whole.

Which brings up another question in my mind... are the SAME people building their other caliber offerings? Is the same (apparent) lack of attention to detail going into those? I dunno, but... I'd rather be at peace with my purchase when I'm fixin' to squeeze the trigger on my rig... especially now that I'm beginning to get into reloading. Too many "what ifs" for me.

constructor
12-26-2010, 02:23 PM
One thing to note is SSA's new "TAC" loads are not as hot or fast as the old "combat" loads they were down loaded around the time of the name change so I don't think there is danger there.
Art told me they had to manufacture ammo that would not be dangerous in the rifles with the worst spec which is the Model 1 9.5 twist SAAMI chamber.
We tried to get Art to load to the better spec rifles like the old "Combat" load but he can not, he's playing it safe and I don't blame him a bit because you know someone would stick a hot load in the worst barrel at some point just because they can.
The Stag barrels seem to be pretty accurate from what I see posted here, some have feeding problems because of the rifle(not M4) ramps but because everyone thought these were 11 twist and shot SSA's Tac loads in them with no damages I have heard of I don't think these barrels are a safety issue. Talking to the guy at CMT about M4 ramps, carriers and other topics I would say the deceit was intentional, he has that screw you, you'll take what I give you and like it attitude.
I guess the thing that gets me is a button cost apx $250 , that is the cost of 1 barrel or 3 hi perf. carbide mill bits, amounts to absolutely nothing when compared to overall production costs. I snapped a $200 carbide reamer in the first 20 seconds of use Fri, it's just part of business.

Robby
12-26-2010, 03:07 PM
Like I said, I like the gun. I enjoy shooting the gun. The gun is very, very accurate and consistent in that accuracy. My point is, that I didn't get what I paid for, and I believe, at least to this point, it was done through deceit. How would you like it, you bought a brand new Corvette, and were told it had a 427 and ran on un-leaded gas. Down the road when the engine blows up, you find out its an older model 390ci engine that absolutely required leaded gas, but they decided to palm them off to keep their bottom line up. Add to that, the engine failure caused an accident in which you lost part of a hand and one eye! I detest liars, of any kind. In court, the burden of proof is on me, I can prove I didn't get what I paid for. Now the burden is on them and depending what attachments I put on my complaint, to prove it was NOT intentional. Taking it to the Law, for me, is the court of last resort, getting them involved is never my first alternative. I absolutely will approach this with aplomb, and diplomacy, and I truly believe Stag will make it right, again that's not the point, they had a chance to make it right when they made it in the first place. I would NEVER try to "stick someone else", what kind of thinking is that? Constructor, I can understand why SSA did that with their "TAC" loads and would support them in their decision as being the wise thing to do. But still it puts people at risk. In hand loading, I never use to experiment, but the arms industry knows that many hand loaders are always trying to load to the max, and you hear it as much as I do. How many are put at risk over this? AAAaaaaaah, feeling better already.
Robby

GS1000SN
12-26-2010, 03:43 PM
Robby- Just trying to give Stag the benefit of the doubt using "wandered".
Your second post using the car engine example is exactly the statement I have used when talking with people about this Stag upper. I did not get what I paid for or was advertised as. I was also real mad at first but have calmed down.

Chickasaw-hunter- Stag did say they were sending me a pick-up on the upper when I called them in October, I just never received it, and they did offer again the first week of November when I called the second time. I am dragging my feet on the return hoping Stag will make changes to the 5H giving it the SPEC II chamber, a 1 in11 twist, mid-length gas system, the M4 ramps and I could return it for an updated version.

Ratdog68- I have only about 53 rounds through this upper and that was to check function and speed so I have no comment on accuracy.

Constructor- Your comment on the CMT rep. does bother me. (I have dealt with people like that before).

If these can be "very,very accurate" per Robby, maybe I should just work at that and forget the velocity part. Accuracy with moderate speed is more to my taste as to barrel burners and my yard only lets me shoot 100-125 yards. As I have said before I have not seen any pressure signs with the few rounds I have run through mine buy these were low speeds. You can get more loadings from the brass at lower pressures.

Isn't the new Rock River 6.8 a 1 in 10?

ksJoe
12-26-2010, 11:20 PM
Does anyone know CMT's insurance company? You could write a letter to them explaining your safety concerns about the issue, and their refusal to correct. Include link to this thread, note that that you're not the only one with the problem. CC Stag customer service.

tjf76
12-28-2010, 01:16 PM
Here is the email I sent to Stag Arms.





Tom,

All of our 6.8SPC rifles and uppers are SPEC 2. If you have any further questions please contact us again.

David
Stag Arms
860-229-9994


From: Tom [mailto:montanaarms@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, December 25, 2010 12:42 AM
To: customerservice@stagarms.com
Subject: Stag 5h 6.8 Upper



I have a 5h upper in 6.8 and want to know if it is Spec II chamber or not. All the barral has stamped on it is stag arms 6.8 spc
1/11

gshellen
12-28-2010, 05:27 PM
Sigh. I have been perusing this forum for a while now. I have considered myself lucky while reading the unhappy threads from many of the Stag 5H owners. My Stag 5H has digested 100's of rounds with zero reliability problems and with great accuracy.

Well, that happiness changed today when I read through this thread then put a cleaning rod through the barrel. I discovered it's really a 1/10 twist (the barrel is labeled "STAG ARMS 6.8 SPC 1/11"). I repeated the process several times to confirm. Now I'm upset about being cheated, velocity limited, and extremely concerned the chamber is not a SPEC 2.

As I own a large stockpile of SSA TAC loads, I'm very thankful I have not gotten around to shooting any. Ditto for pushing my reloads to maximum velocity.

I called Stag and spoke with David. He confirmed the SPEC 2 chamber (is it really, can I trust Stag?) and stated they outsource their barrels and cannot confirm the spec's (?). I should be receiving a return label shortly so they can review it.


I'll post back on how Stag handles this.

tjf76
12-28-2010, 06:54 PM
Sigh. I have been perusing this forum for a while now. I have considered myself lucky while reading the unhappy threads from many of the Stag 5H owners. My Stag 5H has digested 100's of rounds with zero reliability problems and with great accuracy.

Well, that happiness changed today when I read through this thread then put a cleaning rod through the barrel. I discovered it's really a 1/10 twist (the barrel is labeled "STAG ARMS 6.8 SPC 1/11"). I repeated the process several times to confirm. Now I'm upset about being cheated, velocity limited, and extremely concerned the chamber is not a SPEC 2.

As I own a large stockpile of SSA TAC loads, I'm very thankful I have not gotten around to shooting any. Ditto for pushing my reloads to maximum velocity.

I called Stag and spoke with David. He confirmed the SPEC 2 chamber (is it really, can I trust Stag?) and stated they outsource their barrels and cannot confirm the spec's (?). I should be receiving a return label shortly so they can review it.


I'll post back on how Stag handles this.

Please keep us posted

GS1000SN
12-28-2010, 08:28 PM
tjf76, Have you checked the twist on your barrel??????????


I don't think I have seen your twist rate mentioned other than the stamping.

tjf76
12-28-2010, 08:45 PM
I have not. I sold it n bought an arp upper

nosaj750
12-28-2010, 10:15 PM
I just checked the twist rate on my SA7 I got last week and it is indeed a 1:11 twist as advertised, what a relief after reading all this!!!!

GSS
12-28-2010, 11:55 PM
I discovered it's really a 1/10 twist (the barrel is labeled "STAG ARMS 6.8 SPC 1/11"). I repeated the process several times to confirm. Now I'm upset about being cheated, velocity limited, and extremely concerned the chamber is not a SPEC 2.

As I own a large stockpile of SSA TAC loads, I'm very thankful I have not gotten around to shooting any. Ditto for pushing my reloads to maximum velocity.

I called Stag and spoke with David. He confirmed the SPEC 2 chamber (is it really, can I trust Stag?).

You can do a chamber/throat test rather easily, either by partially sizing a case neck and long seating a bullet, then chambering to determine OAL to the rifling. If about 0.100" more than your mag length loads, it's a SpecII.
Or push and hold a bullet into the lands, then measure the distance from the muzzle. Compare that to a measurement for a chambered loaded (preferably a dummy!) round. The difference should be in the 0.100" area.
Even better is a Cerrosafe casting, but that's a little more trouble.

I don't agree that you are "velocity limited" to a measurable or meaningful amount, simply because you have a 1:10 twist vs a 1:11. But I agree it's mighty poor marketing on the part of Stag.

Ticonderoga
01-13-2011, 02:26 AM
I read a similar thread as this on the Firing Line board about a guy who bought 3 rifles from Ed Brown and had a similar "bait and switch" complaint. In that case, the guy ordered a hunting gun but it came with a bull barrel. His complaint was that he put his order in on the phone, with a salesperson and told them that it was a hunting rifle and that the website link was wrong. He did order the wrong gun but as the website was wrong and the salesperson knew his intent and missed it, he was mad.

I see a lot of parallels with both cases. In both cases, there was some culpability on the part of the company. What should be their response? They should fix the problem. It is a cost of doing business. You don't hem and haw, you just fix what is wrong and take a hit on your profits; those profits will come back because you have happy customers.

Now, as I will never buy an Ed Brown gun because of that other thread, Stag just lost my business. As a newbie to the 6.8 world, I have yet to buy my first upper but I am shopping. In my mind, perhaps for the next 10 years, "Stag" will always be associated with bad ethical behavior and they will not be earning my business.

Ticonderoga
01-13-2011, 02:51 AM
I just shot off an email to Stag:
Stag Arms unethical business practices


<NOBR>Thursday, January 13, 2011 10:45 AM</NOBR>

From:
"Scott xyxy" scott_xyxy@yahoo.com (scott_xyxy@yahoo.com)



To:
customerservice@stagarms.com



<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top>Stag,

I am returning to the United States from a few years overseas. I am planning a few well earned hunting trips and have purchased a few arms this month and I'm also shopping for a 6.8 upper.

I just finished reading a thread about your company mislabling your barrels. Not only is this unethical, it is very dangerous.

http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?17702-Stag-Arms-and-Spec-II (http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?17702-Stag-Arms-and-Spec-II)

What is worse is that you seem to be dragging your feet to fix the problem.

I just wanted to remind you that gun owners to talk and your name is getting smeared, I can't believe that you wouldn't aggressively fix this problem.

Needless to say, as a potential new customer, you've lost my business.


Scott
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>



Perhaps if they get enogh blowback they'll get the idea...

Around the World and Back (http://scotttraveler.wordpress.com)

StagArms
01-13-2011, 10:23 AM
To all who are concerned,

My name is David, the one that some of the people on the thread have conversed with. I would like to first clear up some misinformation. We manufacture 80% of our rifles in house. The plastic parts, barrels, and accessories are manufactured by companies who specialize in those areas. The issue of this thread is that some of you received barrels with 1/10 twist instead of 1/11 which was advertised. We want to apologize to all of you for this problem. We ordered 1/11 twist barrels from our 6.8 barrel manufacturer whom we had worked with for years and trusted them it would be 1/11 twist. This apparently was not the case. We currently have the 1/11 twist barrels and got rid of the 1/10 twist barrels.

If you have a 1/10 twist barrel on your uppers we will replace the barrel on it for you for free. All of our returns for this are done via pre-paid UPS shipping labels e-mailed to our customers. Sometimes things happen with e-mail such as the address entered incorrectly or spam filters catching the messages. This is why we tell our customers if you don't receive it by 5:30 that evening to please contact us again and we will figure out what happened and get the label to you.

All of the 6.8 barrels we offer have the SAAMI SPEC 2 chamber because we check for it. Only about the first 50 Model 5 rifles we offered had to SPEC 1 chamber because the SPEC 2 chamber didn't exist at that time. We have gotten these rifles back, rebarreled them, and destroyed the old barrels.

If you have the 1/10 twist barrel and would like to set up a return please e-mail me at customerservice@stagarms.com ATTN: David or call 860-229-9994 x3 and anyone who answers the phone will be able to help you.

David
Stag Arms

68WJ
01-13-2011, 10:27 AM
Thanks David. I don't personally own a Stag, but I appreciate your involvment. It is good to see another manufacturer here stand by their product. Unfortunately, you wouldn't be the first victim of bad barrels either.

gshellen
01-13-2011, 02:05 PM
True to his word (David's), Stag sent a shipping label after I got off the phone. I boxed it up and shipped the same day (unfortunately, never checking the barrel's chamber as it out the door before I read GSS's posting. BTW, thanks GSS for the 'How To').

I just got off the phone with Paul from Stag. They replaced the barrel and will be shipping it back shortly. I'm a little disappointed their QA didn't catch the error, however, when the problem was found, Stag was very polite, easy to work with, and quickly fixed the problem. No arguments, no hassles.

I can't wait to take it to the range.

David/Paul/Stag... thank you!

Ticonderoga
01-13-2011, 03:13 PM
I'll send a seperate email to David on email - it is good to see this reply (as opposed to Ed Brown's non reply). Giving them the benefit of the doubt, perhaps Stag did not know the depth of the problem...?

tjf76
01-13-2011, 04:08 PM
I am glad to see it. I am still a Stag fan, I have a upper in 556 by them and its been great.

sheepdognj
01-13-2011, 04:16 PM
I just bought a 5h upper with 1/11 twist stamped on the barrel but how do I know if its the spec II chamber?


If it is new or very recent, then it is SPEC II. The catalogue/brochure lists them as SPEC II.

Constructor from here (I believe that it was he) also once wrote that some of their barrels labled 1:11 were actually 1:10. On the post were instructions on how to check. I never checked mine as it functioned fine out of the box, but maybe I should.

68WJ
01-13-2011, 04:25 PM
If it is new or very recent, then it is SPEC II. The catalogue/brochure lists them as SPEC II.

Constructor from here (I believe that it was he) also once wrote that some of their barrels labled 1:11 were actually 1:10. On the post were instructions on how to check. I never checked mine as it functioned fine out of the box, but maybe I should.
Post 40 .

first68
01-13-2011, 04:26 PM
That would be something if they could just make the correction with M4 Ramps!

David, how do we know whether we have 1/10 or 1/11? I was under the impression they were mis-stamped...




To all who are concerned,

My name is David, the one that some of the people on the thread have conversed with. I would like to first clear up some misinformation. We manufacture 80% of our rifles in house. The plastic parts, barrels, and accessories are manufactured by companies who specialize in those areas. The issue of this thread is that some of you received barrels with 1/10 twist instead of 1/11 which was advertised. We want to apologize to all of you for this problem. We ordered 1/11 twist barrels from our 6.8 barrel manufacturer whom we had worked with for years and trusted them it would be 1/11 twist. This apparently was not the case. We currently have the 1/11 twist barrels and got rid of the 1/10 twist barrels.

If you have a 1/10 twist barrel on your uppers we will replace the barrel on it for you for free. All of our returns for this are done via pre-paid UPS shipping labels e-mailed to our customers. Sometimes things happen with e-mail such as the address entered incorrectly or spam filters catching the messages. This is why we tell our customers if you don't receive it by 5:30 that evening to please contact us again and we will figure out what happened and get the label to you.

All of the 6.8 barrels we offer have the SAAMI SPEC 2 chamber because we check for it. Only about the first 50 Model 5 rifles we offered had to SPEC 1 chamber because the SPEC 2 chamber didn't exist at that time. We have gotten these rifles back, rebarreled them, and destroyed the old barrels.

If you have the 1/10 twist barrel and would like to set up a return please e-mail me at customerservice@stagarms.com ATTN: David or call 860-229-9994 x3 and anyone who answers the phone will be able to help you.

David
Stag Arms

sheepdognj
01-13-2011, 04:31 PM
Post 40 .

Forgive me, I was trying to be brief. I wanted to add that a forum member had wrote about it earlier in addition to what came out from the company. I also intended to indicate that on the forum could be found instructions on how to check.

Ticonderoga
01-14-2011, 03:12 AM
Just as soon as I started looking at Stag uppers again, I found this thread:

http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?17233-Stag-Arms-7L-Hunter-Feeding-Issues

The ARP upper is looking better and better... now, if they would just answer my emails...?

constructor
01-14-2011, 03:29 AM
Just as soon as I started looking at Stag uppers again, I found this thread:

http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?17233-Stag-Arms-7L-Hunter-Feeding-Issues

The ARP upper is looking better and better... now, if they would just answer my emails...?

When did you send the emails and to where?

ArtFWTx
01-14-2011, 10:50 AM
To all who are concerned,

My name is David, the one that some of the people on the thread have conversed with. I would like to first clear up some misinformation. We manufacture 80% of our rifles in house. The plastic parts, barrels, and accessories are manufactured by companies who specialize in those areas. The issue of this thread is that some of you received barrels with 1/10 twist instead of 1/11 which was advertised. We want to apologize to all of you for this problem. We ordered 1/11 twist barrels from our 6.8 barrel manufacturer whom we had worked with for years and trusted them it would be 1/11 twist. This apparently was not the case. We currently have the 1/11 twist barrels and got rid of the 1/10 twist barrels.

If you have a 1/10 twist barrel on your uppers we will replace the barrel on it for you for free. All of our returns for this are done via pre-paid UPS shipping labels e-mailed to our customers. Sometimes things happen with e-mail such as the address entered incorrectly or spam filters catching the messages. This is why we tell our customers if you don't receive it by 5:30 that evening to please contact us again and we will figure out what happened and get the label to you.

All of the 6.8 barrels we offer have the SAAMI SPEC 2 chamber because we check for it. Only about the first 50 Model 5 rifles we offered had to SPEC 1 chamber because the SPEC 2 chamber didn't exist at that time. We have gotten these rifles back, rebarreled them, and destroyed the old barrels.

If you have the 1/10 twist barrel and would like to set up a return please e-mail me at customerservice@stagarms.com ATTN: David or call 860-229-9994 x3 and anyone who answers the phone will be able to help you.

David
Stag Arms

David, nice to see you stepping in and doing your best to make things right for your customers. Feel free to participate in the forum.

What's with some of these barrel makers? We all know one in particular who sent Constructor a batch of alleged premium barrels with crooked chambers. The barrels were rejected. Then the barrel maker tried to pawn the bad barrels to another AR manufacturer. Now we confirm Stag's barrel supplier goofed up somehow. I guess barrels are like fast food, check your order for accuracy before you drive away with it. (Wendy's, yeah I'm talking about you.... )

P.S. David, your 6.8's are very popular. Stag has supported the 6.8 by offering good barrel specs and moving to them quicker than other AR manufacturers. We appreciate that. Your 6.8s would be pretty close to perfect if you started manufacturing them with M4 feedramps. There are threads in the forum about that as well. Some have perfect reliability, others have perfect reliability "after" adding M4 feedramps. Stag just earned a ton of respect with you showing up here to take care of your customers. We'd hire a choir to sing if Stag started offering 6.8s with M4 receivers and barrel extensions......

StagArms
01-14-2011, 12:54 PM
Ticonderoga: If you haven't received a reply to your e-mail please call us. We reply to 99% of all e-mails within 24 hours. If you haven't received a reply there might be a problem with the e-mail system itself.

gshellen
01-14-2011, 01:33 PM
GREAT NEWS!
I just got a call from Stag (David). My upper return has been delayed for a few more days while their new parts come in. It seems Stag is listening to our comments and will be including M4 ramps on all new 6.8 rifles... including my upper. Way to go Stag!

100%TEXAN
01-14-2011, 01:44 PM
I had a Stag Spec II 1/11 6.8 for a few years and never had a feeding problem or any other reason to call Stag CS. However after seeing Stag get involved with current customers problems and future customers concerns I would absolutely go with Stag again beause I was starting to wonder if Stag would ever step up and fix the problems. I hope all future Stag owners are as lucky as I was with my 5H. Also glad to hear about the M4 feedramps.

coldchili
01-14-2011, 02:10 PM
Ok so Stag is now adding M4 feed ramps to all 6.8 rifles? What about the 6.8 owners without feed ramps?

My 7L hasen't had a feed issue but I have less than 30 rounds (SSA) through it, using the factory 5 round mag. Is the feed ramp necassary in that case?

I've read that the larger capacity and/or non-stag arms mags contribute to the feeding issues, so If I want to run a larger capacity and/or different brand mag do I need the feed ramps?

Like others have said, its a big investment and I just want it to work right.
Thanks

100%TEXAN
01-14-2011, 02:13 PM
I ran Barrett 30 rd mags with mine and never had a problem

ArtFWTx
01-14-2011, 02:17 PM
GREAT NEWS!
I just got a call from Stag (David). My upper return has been delayed for a few more days while their new parts come in. It seems Stag is listening to our comments and will be including M4 ramps on all new 6.8 rifles... including my upper. Way to go Stag!

Nice conclusion. Good news on the M4 feedramps. Stag has always had a good 6.8 line up with the Model 5 and 7. The main criticism was the lack of the M4 ramps that some owners had issues with. If they're moving to the M4 ramps, Stag will be a very strong contender as one of the better production uppers available in 6.8. If you want a longer barrel for hunting and range work, the Model 7 is there. If you want a solid all around carbine then the Model 5 shines.

Robby
01-14-2011, 02:30 PM
Thank you Stag Arms, way to step up David!
Robby

Ratdog68
01-14-2011, 07:49 PM
Thank you Stag Arms/David. Your decision to act on the concerns, and for the advisory of the barrel specs (and, how it happened) are a great means of bolstering confidence in the Stag products.

tbready
01-14-2011, 09:38 PM
About damn time. Now maybe people will actually buy them with no worries. Better sales on thier part.

Ticonderoga
01-15-2011, 08:17 AM
I wonder if they will have past clients mail their uppers in for mods?

tjf76
01-15-2011, 09:31 AM
This is great news! This will for sure build everyones confidence in stags 6.8 uppers and rifles.

first68
01-15-2011, 12:29 PM
I wonder if they will have past clients mail their uppers in for mods?

Sent an email on this question to David last night, will keep you posted.

dessl
01-15-2011, 01:13 PM
I just shot off an email to Stag:
Stag Arms unethical business practices


<NOBR>Thursday, January 13, 2011 10:45 AM</NOBR>

From:
"Scott xyxy" scott_xyxy@yahoo.com (scott_xyxy@yahoo.com)



To:
customerservice@stagarms.com



<TABLE border=0 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top>Stag,

I am returning to the United States from a few years overseas. I am planning a few well earned hunting trips and have purchased a few arms this month and I'm also shopping for a 6.8 upper.

I just finished reading a thread about your company mislabling your barrels. Not only is this unethical, it is very dangerous.

http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?17702-Stag-Arms-and-Spec-II (http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?17702-Stag-Arms-and-Spec-II)

What is worse is that you seem to be dragging your feet to fix the problem.

I just wanted to remind you that gun owners to talk and your name is getting smeared, I can't believe that you wouldn't aggressively fix this problem.

Needless to say, as a potential new customer, you've lost my business.


Scott


</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>



Perhaps if they get enogh blowback they'll get the idea...

Around the World and Back (http://scotttraveler.wordpress.com)

Thanks Scott! Looks like your email to Stag got the ball rolling.

nosaj750
01-15-2011, 01:29 PM
My new model 7 is stamped Stag Arms 6.8spc 1/11 so who knows what it really is with all the conflicting info about Stag Arms. It doesn't seem like there is any consistency with any of them.

Bandit12
01-15-2011, 10:37 PM
Just checked my Stag 5. It is marked 1/11 but actually measures 1/10. Crap! Looks like I'll be contacting David on monday. At least it looks like Stag is standing behind their product. Love the rifle so far.

ksJoe
01-15-2011, 11:43 PM
I haven't checked my 5h. I haven't decided if I want to know. It shoots very accurate, and I don't know that I want to roll the dice with a new barrel (though I hear theirs usually are accurate).

It showed pressure signs a little quicker than I would have thought based on what I've read. So I wouldn't be surprised if it was a 1:10. Can anyone tell me how much more powder & how much faster I can go with a 1:11 vs a 1:10?

Ticonderoga
01-16-2011, 10:56 AM
This is great news! This will for sure build everyones confidence in stags 6.8 uppers and rifles.

Well, apparently its not building everyone's confidence:

posted by Dog Company:

http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?17233-Stag-Arms-7L-Hunter-Feeding-Issues/page7


All,

After much anticipation of receiving my weapon back from Stag Arms, I'm sorry to report that after replacing the upper I am still getting FTRTB. If you look at my original pictures of the malfunction, just take that and make it 50% worse. I tried the SSA 110 gr barnes tsx tac round again. I considered buying some 85 grain stuff, but I didn't want to spend any more money on this problem, plus it appears that the 6.8 was originally designed for the 110-115 grain stuff (no flaming on that, just my observation after doing a lot of research). I want 110 gr rounds to feed. I've decided to part with the weapon and will be selling it shortly. I haven't put any thought into my replacement weapon, but will be soon. Thank you all for this site and the valuable information it provided me.

tjf76
01-16-2011, 11:17 AM
Well, apparently its not building everyone's confidence:

posted by Dog Company:

http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?17233-Stag-Arms-7L-Hunter-Feeding-Issues/page7


All,

After much anticipation of receiving my weapon back from Stag Arms, I'm sorry to report that after replacing the upper I am still getting FTRTB. If you look at my original pictures of the malfunction, just take that and make it 50% worse. I tried the SSA 110 gr barnes tsx tac round again. I considered buying some 85 grain stuff, but I didn't want to spend any more money on this problem, plus it appears that the 6.8 was originally designed for the 110-115 grain stuff (no flaming on that, just my observation after doing a lot of research). I want 110 gr rounds to feed. I've decided to part with the weapon and will be selling it shortly. I haven't put any thought into my replacement weapon, but will be soon. Thank you all for this site and the valuable information it provided me.


That sucks! Hope it works out for him.

ArtFWTx
01-16-2011, 11:31 AM
Ticonderoga... did Stag just replace the barrel with another like kind quality? If it came back with the right twist but no M4 feedramps, it's obvious nothing would change.

IF your barrel came back with the correct twist, that's a start. It still needs M4 feed ramps.

Robby
01-16-2011, 12:09 PM
I was told, by David, That I will have a new barrel, AND M4 feed ramps when the upper is returned. If I remember correctly, he said, in the future all their guns will have the enhanced feed ramps. I have never experienced any feeding problems, and the barrel is, like I stated before, very accurate, and consistently so. There in lies my dilemma. Do I send it back, or do I keep it the way it is, kind of the devil you know against the devil you don't know. Seems the right thing to do is to send it back. I could never sell the gun without a complete explanation of the barrel situation, or if it gets passed down to one of my kids and they forget, or sell it that information most probably will be forgotten. So I will, with some misgiving, but hoping for the best.
Robby

barncat
01-16-2011, 12:24 PM
I was told, by David, That I will have a new barrel, AND M4 feed ramps when the upper is returned. If I remember correctly, he said, in the future all their guns will have the enhanced feed ramps. I have never experienced any feeding problems, and the barrel is, like I stated before, very accurate, and consistently so. There in lies my dilemma. Do I send it back, or do I keep it the way it is, kind of the devil you know against the devil you don't know. Seems the right thing to do is to send it back. I could never sell the gun without a complete explanation of the barrel situation, or if it gets passed down to one of my kids and they forget, or sell it that information most probably will be forgotten. So I will, with some misgiving, but hoping for the best.
Robby

I would send it in. If anything it will help on resale. Ya never know, the knew barrel may be even more accurate???

Ticonderoga
01-16-2011, 12:32 PM
Ticonderoga... did Stag just replace the barrel with another like kind quality? If it came back with the right twist but no M4 feedramps, it's obvious nothing would change.

IF your barrel came back with the correct twist, that's a start. It still needs M4 feed ramps.

Not sure exactly what Stag did to fix his upper; there were a few that replied on that thread that had similar issues; one guy sent his upper, it was returned with a 1/2 box of ammo, no explanation as to what might have been fixed and it still didin't work. I put a link to that thread in my post, I'd recommend reading the whole 7 pages of it if you have time.

My point was, I am more reluctant (than some) to immediately start patting Stag on the back for saying they will fix the problem. I'll hold my breath until after the issues are resolved before I make final judgment.

Bandit12
01-19-2011, 08:59 AM
I spoke with David yesterday about my 1/10 barrel. He told me to send the upper in with bolt for a barrel replacement. I also asked about the M4 feed ramps and was told those would be added as well. The shipping lable arrived promptly via e mail. I'll be getting it shipped out today. It was a very no hassle experience so far. Only downside is waiting for it to return.

first68
01-19-2011, 10:21 PM
QUESTION TO STAG: I see that Stag finally sees value in M4 ramps for 6.8 uppers. Are there plans to retrofit uppers for customers who have already purchased?

RESPONSE FROM STAG:

"At this time unless there is a twist rate discrepancy between the actual twist rate and the twist rate engraved on the barrel we do not plan to offer retrofit of uppers."

So, based on this response and others; if you have a bad or mis-stamped barrel, it will be replaced and the NEW BARREL will have M4 ramps. If not, send to ADCO or Do-it-Yourself. I have never had a problem, but I then usually shoot from a 5rnd mag.

ksJoe
01-19-2011, 10:32 PM
Do the new barrels still have their odd 1/2 x 36 threads?

Ticonderoga
01-20-2011, 05:35 PM
Penny wise, pound foolish...

This craziness cost them my business, I can only wonder how many more. The cost of modifying some feed ramps would have been more than offset by new business and goodwill.

Well, lucky for them that AR owners don't talk to each other (yeah right).

ArtFWTx
01-20-2011, 05:44 PM
Do the new barrels still have their odd 1/2 x 36 threads?

Pretty sure they do. At least YHM is making 6.8 muzzle devices for this thread pitch. The rest of the industry is 5/8x24.

first68
01-20-2011, 11:42 PM
PWS does also. They have a .30 brake with a Stag appropriate adapter:

http://primaryweapons.com/store/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=37&idcategory=6


Pretty sure they do. At least YHM is making 6.8 muzzle devices for this thread pitch. The rest of the industry is 5/8x24.

GS1000SN
02-12-2011, 06:41 PM
I would like to know if anyone who returned their upper to Stag has received it back from them?

aldock1
02-12-2011, 09:11 PM
Sent my upper to David at Stag several weeks ago for the barrel switch. I sent David an e-mail on January 31 inquiring when I would expect the return. He responded the same day saying the barrels were back ordered but were expected that same week. I have not heard anything since.

I enjoy perusing this site daily. New to AR's so I have had nothing to contribute. This is a great site! Research here helped me choose LaRue mounts and a great ACOG 4X for my new-unshot Stag Model 5......

Bandit12
02-12-2011, 09:50 PM
Still patiently waiting for mine. I called earlier in the week and was told that the barrels were getting phosphate coated and were close to being ready. Hopefully it won't be much longer. My new viper vortex is sitting here waiting, can't wait to try it out!
I would like to know if anyone who returned their upper to Stag has received it back from them?

Robby
02-13-2011, 12:07 PM
Sent them an E-mail yesterday, probably won't hear till tomorrow. Sounds like they are getting close to wrapping things up.
Robby

Robby
02-14-2011, 10:37 AM
I just received an E-mail from David, the upper should be sent back this week.
Robby

aldock1
02-14-2011, 03:16 PM
I just received an e-mail response from David saying the new barrels were in and would be retrofitted and shipped today. Of interest was he indicated the new barrels had "M4 Feed Ramps."

a1hunter
02-14-2011, 10:31 PM
okay after reading this post i have a 5h and was wondering what the tops of there barrel says cause mine say 6.8 SPC 1/11. when i look at the ar15 barrels picture it is the picture in the top left the ramps do not extend down into the lower portion of the reciever. of the guys that recieve there 5h back how do your feed ramps look. i checked the twist rate and i ran the cleaning rod about 20 times i got a couple 1/10 and a couple 1/11. i'm about to turn this cleaning rod into a boomarang.

Bandit12
02-14-2011, 10:58 PM
I haven't got my 5H back yet to report on the m4 feed ramps, which they are supposed to be adding. Make sure the patch fits tight and rotates with the rifleing, pull it out till it makes 1 full revolution, and measure the distance. My barrel was marked 6.8spc 1/11 and doesn't have the m4 ramps. I had inconsistant measurements untill I found a patch that fit tight enough to follow the lands accurately. Just go slow, it was obvious with mine that it wasn't 1/11. How old is yours? Mine was purchased about 15 months ago, direct from Stag. I chose Stag at the time because of a magazine acticle that praised Stag's accuracy and it's 1/11 barrel. I probably wouldn't have even checked the twist if it haden't been for this site. I just trusted the stamping.

aldock1
02-14-2011, 11:16 PM
a1hunter...my measurements varied as well and I thought the patch on the cleaning rod was plenty tight. I called David at Stag and he seemed only interested in what was stamped on the barrel. After describing what was on the barrel he told me it should be returned and I received the "UPS Return Label" that afternoon. He was very cordial and the return was simple...

a1hunter
02-14-2011, 11:31 PM
well i guess i will be calling david this week to setup a ups return label. i have another 6.8 on the way and will be reloading my ammo i want to stay with the same rate of twist on both guns. Hoping to find a happy medium for both to hunt with since my wife and daughter will be using the 5h.

ShannonGTO
02-14-2011, 11:47 PM
I just received an e-mail response from David saying the new barrels were in and would be retrofitted and shipped today. Of interest was he indicated the new barrels had "M4 Feed Ramps."

UMMM Bull****...This is an email from friday....As in 11Feb11

All of our rifles have standard feedramps. What exactly is the issue you are having?

David
Stag Arms
860-229-9994

Robby
02-15-2011, 10:22 AM
Hmmmm, Sounds like a mixed message. In my phone conversation with David, before I sent the upper back, he said the M4 ramps would be installed. I should know for sure before the end of the week.
Robby

ShannonGTO
02-15-2011, 11:39 AM
Hmmmm, Sounds like a mixed message. In my phone conversation with David, before I sent the upper back, he said the M4 ramps would be installed. I should know for sure before the end of the week.
Robby


ok dude hope you get it, I won't...And as far as the proof gimme your ****in email and I will send the back and forth conversations....

Bull001
02-15-2011, 11:46 AM
Disregard this post, i made a premature statement before i read everything. I didn't realize this went on for 10 pages.

Robby
02-15-2011, 01:35 PM
Shannon, Is it possible that you miss-read the intention of my posting, or that I am miss-reading the Attitude expressed in yours? First off, I'm not "dude", its Robby. Second, I don't have a F'n email, just a regular one like everyone else. What I was trying to say, is that Stag, or David, is sending a mixed message by telling you one thing and me, along with a few others, that they will include the M4 ramps. Further, I was told I will be receiving my barrel sometime this week, soooooooo, one way or another, I will know the truth as it was told to me.
Robby

ArtFWTx
02-15-2011, 01:47 PM
Keep it nice guys. All on the same side following the situation here. Shannon, no one is doubting the emails you've received from Stag. Robby is relaying what he's hearing from Stag.

I'm sure Robby is going to post pics of his new Stag barrel, including the feed ramps area when he receives it. That should tell the whole story.

From what I've read here, Stag is replacing the barrels mismarked 1:11 that were actually 10 twist with new barrels that are supposed to have M4 feedramps in the barrel extension and the upper receiver. It sounds like going forward Stag is migrating production to include M4 feed ramps in their 6.8 products which is a very good thing for them to do.

For current Stag owners with "correct" barrel markings, and no M4 feed ramps, you are on your own to have M4 feed ramps filed into your extension and receivers. Stag is "not" considering the lack of M4 feed ramps as a warranty item like they are the mismarked barrels.

That's pretty much where we stand as of now, right? Well at least until Robby and the others get their uppers back from Stag.

ShannonGTO
02-15-2011, 02:34 PM
Shannon, Is it possible that you miss-read the intention of my posting, or that I am miss-reading the Attitude expressed in yours? First off, I'm not "dude", its Robby. Second, I don't have a F'n email, just a regular one like everyone else. What I was trying to say, is that Stag, or David, is sending a mixed message by telling you one thing and me, along with a few others, that they will include the M4 ramps. Further, I was told I will be receiving my barrel sometime this week, soooooooo, one way or another, I will know the truth as it was told to me.
Robby


Oh ok no I took it the other way...I go straight from 0 to shooting and asking questions later first...Character flaw I guess I picked up in a dam sand box....
He might be. but now Im mad...If yall get it, I better dam sure get mine... I never payed attention to all this stuff in the military, I didn't really need to know about rifle feed ramps and M4 feedramps....or if I had a class of which I went to hundreds, I was probably sleeping with my eyes open....Good trick, you should practice sometime..lol
All I know it yours does have it...I will make it my mission if life to run that company in the ground on every AR website there is...

ShannonGTO
02-15-2011, 02:37 PM
Also he screwed himself by saying ALL of their weapons have reegular ramps...Yall getting some here and there isnt ALL...So he just held himself liable..

Bull001
02-15-2011, 03:09 PM
We're talking about M4 ramps in the barrel or the reciever? I'm trying to get this straight in my head... I thought barrels come standard with ramps cut in them. The "M4 Feed Ramps" are when you cut into the reciever to match the barrel/chamber ramps correct?

MCA
02-15-2011, 03:20 PM
Here you go:

http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?8955-Feed-Ramp-Compairson-Picture

ShannonGTO
02-15-2011, 03:46 PM
[QUOTE=Bull001;189126]We're talking about M4 ramps in the barrel or the reciever? I'm trying to get this straight in my head... I thought barrels come standard with ramps cut in them. The "M4 Feed Ramps" are when you cut into the reciever to match the barrel/chamber ramps correct?[/QUOTE

The way I understood...We a supposed to have M4 ramps and receivers when we buy these...Now so peolple are bitching about feed problems and this David guy is giving them what they were supposed to have in the first place....I now want mine...My Stag has hiccup'd afew times and I know its not the mags...

Bull001
02-15-2011, 03:49 PM
I understand now, thanks MCA. Do you have the 1/10 marked as a 1/11 Shannon? Or just the older 1/10 flat out?

ShannonGTO
02-15-2011, 03:57 PM
I understand now, thanks MCA. Do you have the 1/10 marked as a 1/11 Shannon? Or just the older 1/10 flat out?

It says Spec 1/11.......Dont have M4 ramps and receivers and not sure if I have the right twist rate...I really don't want to look....My back has been ****ing killing me and the VA sucks ass with pain meds...Im up to 240mg morphine a day and it now doesnt help....For you idiots still in the military...DO NOT JUMP OUT OF PERFECTLY GOOD A/C

Bull001
02-15-2011, 04:07 PM
It says Spec 1/11.......Dont have M4 ramps and receivers and not sure if I have the right twist rate...I really don't want to look....My back has been ****ing killing me and the VA sucks ass with pain meds...Im up to 240mg morphine a day and it now doesnt help....For you idiots still in the military...DO NOT JUMP OUT OF PERFECTLY GOOD A/C

Sounds like you have bigger fish to fry buddy. Get a friend to help you check your twist rate. If you confirm that you have a 1/10, then just send it in and get the whole shabang taken care of. If you have the 1/11, then try to bring an easy going, polite and diplomatic solution. Yelling at David will get you nowhere. Trust me, I know.

ShannonGTO
02-15-2011, 04:28 PM
Sounds like you have bigger fish to fry buddy. Get a friend to help you check your twist rate. If you confirm that you have a 1/10, then just send it in and get the whole shabang taken care of. If you have the 1/11, then try to bring an easy going, polite and diplomatic solution. Yelling at David will get you nowhere. Trust me, I know.


Oh I haven't gone off yet...It shoots as well as an M24 and I only need one shot anyways....lol

ksJoe
02-15-2011, 08:10 PM
a1hunter...my measurements varied as well and I thought the patch on the cleaning rod was plenty tight. I called David at Stag and he seemed only interested in what was stamped on the barrel. After describing what was on the barrel he told me it should be returned and I received the "UPS Return Label" that afternoon. He was very cordial and the return was simple...

Do you happen to have a photo of your barrel marks?

Since all he cared about was the stamp, if someone posted a photo of the bad stamp then people wouldn't have to try to measure themselves.

aldock1
02-15-2011, 10:40 PM
ksJoe...
Only thing I found on the barrel was...Stag Arms 6.8 SPC 1/11...nothing else. He asked twice. Then gave me instructions on sending it back.

a1hunter
02-16-2011, 05:03 PM
lets get this back to the top would like to start hearing from the guys that are getting their uppers back

GS1000SN
02-16-2011, 08:49 PM
Funny that my thread about this back in October died with two replies.



http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?16568-Stag-5H-6.8-stamped-1-11-but-really-a-1-in-10

nosaj750
02-16-2011, 10:21 PM
a1hunter...my measurements varied as well and I thought the patch on the cleaning rod was plenty tight. I called David at Stag and he seemed only interested in what was stamped on the barrel. After describing what was on the barrel he told me it should be returned and I received the "UPS Return Label" that afternoon. He was very cordial and the return was simple...

Hey aldock1 what exactly is stamped on your barrel? I'm curious to hear what they are saying the screwed up barrels are stamped with?

ShannonGTO
02-16-2011, 11:39 PM
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m162/Shannon4617/SANY0026.jpg



here

94user
02-17-2011, 06:36 PM
I have one that is marked identical to the one above in the pic. I cannot get my cleaning rod to turn in order to check the twist.

nosaj750
02-17-2011, 09:47 PM
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m162/Shannon4617/SANY0026.jpg



here

Is this all 6.8 barrels marked like this or just the model 5 barrels? I'm pretty sure my model 7 has the same stamp but not 100% sure, I'll did it out this weekend to confirm.

ShannonGTO
02-17-2011, 11:55 PM
Is this all 6.8 barrels marked like this or just the model 5 barrels? I'm pretty sure my model 7 has the same stamp but not 100% sure, I'll did it out this weekend to confirm.

Thats thr model 7...Im taking it to a gunsmith tomorrow

constructor
02-18-2011, 02:27 AM
Funny that my thread about this back in October died with two replies.



http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?16568-Stag-5H-6.8-stamped-1-11-but-really-a-1-in-10
No one wanted to believe it.

ShannonGTO
02-18-2011, 09:49 AM
No one wanted to believe it.

And I wasnt here......The only thing thats dies around me are things that wear rags on their heads...:a31:

Madcat
02-18-2011, 05:18 PM
I just checked my stag 5H and it is in fact 1/11. My barrel loves 115gr bullets and hates 85 gr. I would guess the 1/11 are more design to the taste of the heavier bullets.

Equalizer_2
02-19-2011, 01:26 AM
I just checked my stag 5H and it is in fact 1/11. My barrel loves 115gr bullets and hates 85 gr. I would guess the 1/11 are more design to the taste of the heavier bullets.

Each barrel is different. There are a lot of guys using 1:11 twist that get excellent accuracy with the 85 gr.

Bushdog45
02-20-2011, 10:51 PM
FWIW, I have an older Stag 5H marked 1/10 Spec II and it has been reliable and failrly accurate with reloads and SSA ammo including the old high power "Combat loads". The only problem I ever had was with the 90 gr. Sierra reload which has a large HP opening causing it to fail to feed sometimes. I sent it to ADCO and had them grind in the M4 ramps and properly stake the gas key. This rifle will shoot sub MOA with H322 powder and 110 Sierras reliably. It doesn't seem to like the 85 Barnes for accuracy and shoots everything else to about 1.5 to 2 MOA. Good to hear Stag will now use the M4 ramps and is taking care of their 6.8 customers. I had a problem with a bolt carrier used on another rifle that they made without the holes drilled in the side and they promptly sent me another.

ShannonGTO
02-22-2011, 11:40 AM
I found this looking around in the middle of the night.....I dont know who has seen this, sorry if it's a repost but I wish I would have seen it before I made my purchase's....

http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pwswheghNQsEuEhjFwPrgTA&single=true&gid=5&output=html

The guy took the chart down but I saved it....Here it is...

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m162/Shannon4617/AllM4Chart.gif

Robby
02-23-2011, 01:07 PM
Trying to find a date to this, all I could come up with was 2007. I wonder if it has been up dated or how it would apply to 6.8 specifically?
Had I seen this chart, would it have affected my decision making? Most definitely, but would be interested to hear comments from those of you that are more knowledgeable on the subject, which is just about everybody!
Stag said they shipped the upper last week, maybe the UPS guy had a flat tire. I will post picture of the feed ramp when I get it.
Robby

jwp1964
02-23-2011, 03:02 PM
My new 5H is suppose to be delivered today via UPS. I'll post a photo of the feed ramp today.

ShannonGTO
02-23-2011, 03:35 PM
Trying to find a date to this, all I could come up with was 2007. I wonder if it has been up dated or how it would apply to 6.8 specifically?
Had I seen this chart, would it have affected my decision making? Most definitely, but would be interested to hear comments from those of you that are more knowledgeable on the subject, which is just about everybody!
Stag said they shipped the upper last week, maybe the UPS guy had a flat tire. I will post picture of the feed ramp when I get it.
Robby



Last week???? That Company is like what? 400 miles from you? I got my upper 3 days after they sent it and I live in Mississippi...

That chart was 5.56 guns but components will be the same as far as how they are made....

jwp1964
02-23-2011, 08:11 PM
OK, the 5H I ordered direct from Stag arrived today. I have posted photos below of feed ramp. I have no idea if it is m4 or not, any comments from the experts?
305730583059

MCA
02-23-2011, 09:52 PM
Sorry JWP - no M4 ramp goodness there.

ShannonGTO
02-23-2011, 10:25 PM
um um um and another bites the dust

jwp1964
02-24-2011, 12:22 AM
I took another look at their website and there is no mention anywhere of the 5H coming with M4 feed ramp. Is M4 feed ramp an industry standard or a nice to have. This is my first AR so I have no idea.

ArtFWTx
02-24-2011, 01:20 AM
I took another look at their website and there is no mention anywhere of the 5H coming with M4 feed ramp. Is M4 feed ramp an industry standard or a nice to have. This is my first AR so I have no idea.

It's a recommended feature for 6.8 ARs and was originally specified by 6.8 designers. The bullet tips sit lower in relation to the feed ramp area than do the thinner 5.56 bullet tips. Thus the M4 ramps provide extra reliability with the 6.8. Most 6.8 manufacturers except for Stag have some variety of M4 feedramps as standard.

Bushmaster, CMMG, Armalite, DPMS, and RRA have some version of extended feed ramps as standard. RRA's are not as deep, but are still there. I listed these off hand as they are competitors to Stag.

Bull001
02-24-2011, 09:49 AM
I thought they were supposed to machine feed ramps into the reciever and the barrel for you guys that sent back 1/10 barrels marked 1/11..... I'm confused.

jwp1964
02-24-2011, 10:41 AM
Mine is brand new. Not a return of a previous barrel.

jwp


I thought they were supposed to machine feed ramps into the reciever and the barrel for you guys that sent back 1/10 barrels marked 1/11..... I'm confused.

Bull001
02-24-2011, 12:31 PM
Sorry, my mistake. I'm usually reading in haste. Got too much to do and not enough time in life.

Robby
02-24-2011, 02:26 PM
I just received my upper from Stag, and here are the much anticipated photo's; Drum roll please! Kidding aside, these look like M4 ramps to me based on what I have gleaned from you guys here, with great appreciation. If they are not, could someone explain what I am missing. I've got to say, as much as I am steeped in the M/L gun-smithing, If I did not live in NYSSR, I would dive into making a 6.8 for myself, like many of you do here. But with all the restrictions in place, I could never bring it up to its full potential. So I will putter along and continue to learn as much as I can. Who knows, things may change.
http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh217/robin101st/DSCN0912.jpg

http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh217/robin101st/DSCN0910.jpg
Thanks fellows,
Robby

ArtFWTx
02-24-2011, 03:03 PM
The extension looks like a M4 extension from here, but the M4 cuts if any in the receiver itself seem to be shallow. Nothing a little dremel time couldn't fix. The ramps in your extension do not appear to blend into receiver ramps like the photo below does. Compare the photo with your receiver.

http://i896.photobucket.com/albums/ac169/artgreg1521/M4feedramps.jpg

ShannonGTO
02-24-2011, 04:33 PM
M4 ramps with a rifle receiver......Let the games begin...

Paulo_Santos
02-24-2011, 05:34 PM
Those are more like the Bushmaster "M2" cuts, as they like to call them.

constructor
02-24-2011, 06:15 PM
Those are more like the Bushmaster "M2" cuts, as they like to call them.
agree too short for M4s

Robby
02-25-2011, 11:48 AM
ArtFWTx, I see the difference. I guess mine are M2.5 ramps, Hah! I took it out yesterday to re-sight it, and all together, fired off about sixty rounds of SPH and OTM's with no failure to feed issues. All in all, I cannot say I am dissatisfied with the gun, and even though I did a lot of homework before I made my decision, knowing what I now know, I would have gone in a different direction in making my purchase. It is fun to shoot, easy to carry, better than what I was issued over forty years ago, and has been totally reliable, so I will enjoy it for what it is.
Robby

ArtFWTx
02-25-2011, 01:08 PM
ArtFWTx, I see the difference. I guess mine are M2.5 ramps, Hah! I took it out yesterday to re-sight it, and all together, fired off about sixty rounds of SPH and OTM's with no failure to feed issues. All in all, I cannot say I am dissatisfied with the gun, and even though I did a lot of homework before I made my decision, knowing what I now know, I would have gone in a different direction in making my purchase. It is fun to shoot, easy to carry, better than what I was issued over forty years ago, and has been totally reliable, so I will enjoy it for what it is.
Robby

You're good to go Robby. Sounds like your rifle is running fine. That's all you ask for right? Stag replaced your barrel and you do have improved feed ramps, so what's not to like now? Go shooting and have fun!!!

I'd consider a Stag with your setup, especially with some of the great pricing Legal Transfers has on Stag uppers. I would be ready to dremel the receiver more if needed. But having the M4 extension is a big plus for Stag to move to.

bxcigrfan
02-25-2011, 06:23 PM
those look like what i have in mine and i purchased my rifle last summer. i kept wondering because i saw that but kept reading that Stag did not do the ramps; but i also so the pics for comparison and since it did not see it protrude into the receiver i thought i was just my imagination playing tricks on me.

aldock1
02-25-2011, 08:39 PM
My upper was returned today via UPS. To my surprise the entire upper was new. M4 cuts and all. Even included a new Magazine..."YIPPIE" Fits the lower perfectly. David was pleasant to speak with...but I give there customer service a score of 7 outa 10. Reason for low score is even though they did what they said they would do...it took far too long.

Bandit12
02-25-2011, 10:58 PM
My upper also came in today. Feed ramps look exactly like Robby's pics. Also like aldock1, my entire upper looks new including the bolt. Came packed in a nice padded box with full paperwork and a new, looks like, 25rd magazine. It did take a couple weeks, but according to David they were waiting on barrels, which aren't made by Stag. I am very happy with the service I received. If it shoots accurately and reliably I'll be very pleased.

How long were you waiting from start to finish aldock1?

first68
02-26-2011, 12:03 AM
Mine came back today also. 15 day turnaround.

Same story "M2" ramps, free C-Products mag, new barrel and upper receiver. Take down pin is now tight, tight, tight. Don't care about the ramps as long as it feeds right. Will try out in next few weeks. Expectations are high.


My upper also came in today. Feed ramps look exactly like Robby's pics. Also like aldock1, my entire upper looks new including the bolt. Came packed in a nice padded box with full paperwork and a new, looks like, 25rd magazine. It did take a couple weeks, but according to David they were waiting on barrels, which aren't made by Stag. I am very happy with the service I received. If it shoots accurately and reliably I'll be very pleased.

How long were you waiting from start to finish aldock1?

aldock1
02-26-2011, 12:12 AM
Bandit....5 weeks. No big deal but I was told it would be an immediate turn-around.

Bandit12
02-26-2011, 12:48 AM
Mine was about 5 weeks also. I wasn't given a turn-around time when I talked to David. I would have liked it back a little quicker as well, but I guess we sent ours in at a time when they were short on barrrels, as first68 only had a 15 day turnaround. None the less, I am glad Stag stepped up and was willing to correct the oversight.

First68, I'm not as experienced with m4 ramps as many are here, but I think the barrel has the M4 extension, it is the receiver that is not cut as deep as a true M4. It is however very different from what I sent in and from my Bushmaster 5.56 rifle feed ramps. Hopefully it will be adequate for proper feeding. My fit to the lower is excellent, just as before. My Bushy is sloppy compared to the Stag.

GS1000SN
02-26-2011, 10:29 PM
My returned upper arrived at Stag on 01/13/2011.
I received my return upper on 02/24/2011.

It has the M4? M2 style feed ramps....pretty shallow to call M4.

My returned upper had the RAILED gas block.... and they returned me a FIXED SIGHT gas block.
Real top rate operation.

There are definite marks that it was test fired. The strikes from the nose of the bullets are on the very bottom edge of the feed ramps on the barrel extension, barely above the receiver cuts. To me, this clearly shows the M4 cuts are necessary.

I may shoot it tomorrow.... NOT HAPPY about them swapping my gas block!!!!!!!!!

tbready
02-26-2011, 11:29 PM
My returned upper arrived at Stag on 01/13/2011.
I received my return upper on 02/24/2011.

It has the M4? M2 style feed ramps....pretty shallow to call M4.

My returned upper had the RAILED gas block.... and they returned me a FIXED SIGHT gas block.
Real top rate operation.

There are definite marks that it was test fired. The strikes from the nose of the bullets are on the very bottom edge of the feed ramps on the barrel extension, barely above the receiver cuts. To me, this clearly shows the M4 cuts are necessary.

I may shoot it tomorrow.... NOT HAPPY about them swapping my gas block!!!!!!!!!

Unreal, why would they change something without your consent. I'd be pissed too. Tell them to send your other gas block back to you. Their CS is questionable sometimes.

kbomb333
02-27-2011, 12:39 AM
I too had an issue with my return. I sent a left-handed reciever mid-January and was sent a right-handed one this week. I just returned it hopefully for the right (left) one this time. I was so tempted to keep the mag they sent with the upper for my troubles, but I couldn't convince the angel on my shoulder to let me. :) The weather is still touch and go for shooting but I'm getting that itch to ring some steel and am anxoius to break that new barrel in.

StagArms
02-28-2011, 10:06 AM
GS1000SN: Please call me at 860-229-9994 x1 and we will get this corrected for you. I shipped the uppers myself and I apologize that I sent you an incorrect one. FYI: The phones have been very busy lately so if your get the voice mail box please leave one and you will have a call back.

David

Bull001
02-28-2011, 12:50 PM
Accidents happen, At least Davis is following this forum!

GAC
02-28-2011, 10:05 PM
Ironically, I just ordered a Stag Arms 5H last Friday and is enroute via UPS. A member from a hunting thread sent me this thread about an hour ago. I read all 15 pages and have a lot more knowledge on this now. I did call Stag Arms last Friday to validate the 1 in 11 inch twist as well as the 6.8 SPC II chamber. The fellow I spoke to verified the upper I would receive has both. I can say that I'll check the twist tomorrow once received. As long as the feed ramps feed consistent and reliably, I'm not concerned what M rating it carries, just absolute reliable feeding.

ArtFWTx
03-01-2011, 12:30 AM
Ironically, I just ordered a Stag Arms 5H last Friday and is enroute via UPS. A member from a hunting thread sent me this thread about an hour ago. I read all 15 pages and have a lot more knowledge on this now. I did call Stag Arms last Friday to validate the 1 in 11 inch twist as well as the 6.8 SPC II chamber. The fellow I spoke to verified the upper I would receive has both. I can say that I'll check the twist tomorrow once received. As long as the feed ramps feed consistent and reliably, I'm not concerned what M rating it carries, just absolute reliable feeding.

Welcome and congrats on the first post. Stag is taking care of those with mismarked barrels, and looks like they are including the M4 receiver extensions and some improvement in the receiver feed areas as well. You should be good to go. If you have any feeding issues, it's easily corrected. Plan on enjoying your new rifle. Congrats again.

GAC
03-01-2011, 09:32 PM
I received my Stag Arms 6.8 SPC upper tonight. Cleaned her well then checked the twist. Every attempt revealved a 1 in 11 inch twist. Although not exact science, I came up with 11 inches, max +/- .25 inch each and every time. The upper fits really well on my Bushmaster M4 lower without play. The fit and finish are fine and actually impressive for a $525 upper receiver group. All in all I'm impressed thus far but the range will reveal all. I changed over my quad rail, light, and placed the Trijicon ACOG in the same index marks as the 5.56 upper. The feed ramps appear to be inbetween M4 ramps and rifle ramps. The grooves extend in to the receiver but not quite as far as my Bushmaster 5.56 M4 upper. My wife commented that it doesn't even look like I bought a new gun and I quickly reminded her that the upper is just parts - not a new gun. Gotta keep her thinking they were just expensive add ons. Really looking forward to the sight in on Friday morning followed by a Friday night and Saturday night hog hunt.

jwp1964
03-05-2011, 05:37 PM
Ok, I just got home from the initial range trip with my brand new Stag Arms 5H upper and I am incredibly disappointed with this product. I shot 17 3 round magazines with a failure to feed rate of over 50%. I used SSA Pro Hunter 110s and S&B 110s. Neither fed correctly. I used the 5 round magazines I purchased from Stag. I had 2 magazines out of 17 make it through with no hiccups. Not impressed is an understatement. I will contact Stag customer service and see what they have to say. I really wish I had seen the forum posts regarding feed issues with Stag before I put out $525 bucks for what amounts to an expensive paperweight!

Madcat
03-05-2011, 06:13 PM
I'm not sure if this would help your situation JWP,but here is something i found out that corrected any FTF issues i have had. I recently broke down and ordered a cp 15 round mag. Shot some accubonds with out a problem.I then tried some SSA115 gr OTM and bam! It slammed the point of the bullet straight in the the receiver instead of loading it into thew ramp. What i did to correct the issue was ,i squeezed the magazine from front to back which widened the mag a bit. FTF issue is now miraculous gone. I had some old worn 5.56 mags that jammed all the time and i fixed them the same way. I didn't deform the mag by any means, and they didn't take much pressure to get them back in order

jwp1964
03-05-2011, 06:16 PM
Thanks for the tip. Waiting to hear from customer service. Probably hear from them next week since it is the weekend.


I'm not sure if this would help your situation JWP,but here is something i found out that corrected any FTF issues i have had. I recently broke down and ordered a cp 15 round mag. Shot some accubonds with out a problem.I then tried some SSA115 gr OTM and bam! It slammed the point of the bullet straight in the the receiver instead of loading it into thew ramp. What i did to correct the issue was ,i squeezed the magazine from front to back which widened the mag a bit. FTF issue is now miraculous gone. I had some old worn 5.56 mags that jammed all the time and i fixed them the same way. I didn't deform the mag by any means, and they didn't take much pressure to get them back in order

ksJoe
03-05-2011, 06:42 PM
jwp, take a look at this.

http://68forums.com/forums/showthread.php?7265-6.8-SPC-Magazine-Lip-Tweaking-Document

nosaj750
03-05-2011, 06:48 PM
Ok, I just got home from the initial range trip with my brand new Stag Arms 5H upper and I am incredibly disappointed with this product. I shot 17 3 round magazines with a failure to feed rate of over 50%. I used SSA Pro Hunter 110s and S&B 110s. Neither fed correctly. I used the 5 round magazines I purchased from Stag. I had 2 magazines out of 17 make it through with no hiccups. Not impressed is an understatement. I will contact Stag customer service and see what they have to say. I really wish I had seen the forum posts regarding feed issues with Stag before I put out $525 bucks for what amounts to an expensive paperweight!

Time to bust out the Dremel!!! I know it sux that you have a brand new upper and shouldn't have to do that but, honestly it's a pretty easy fix....Unfortunately that's the chance we all take buying a Stag 6.8...

jwp1964
03-05-2011, 07:25 PM
With so many people having this problem why doesn't Stag just fix the problem? Seems to me they should pick up the tab for me to get feed ramps that work. All new products have an implied warranty that they actually work. This product does not work as advertised or as designed to (unless a less than 50% feed rate is the design). There is No Way that anyone who needed to defend him/herself could count on this weapon.

I'm not doing the job myself because if something else were to be a problem they would void my warranty for doing a mod. I guess you get what you pay for. Should have just spent the extra money and got an ARP.


Time to bust out the Dremel!!! I know it sux that you have a brand new upper and shouldn't have to do that but, honestly it's a pretty easy fix....Unfortunately that's the chance we all take buying a Stag 6.8...

Paulo_Santos
03-05-2011, 07:51 PM
With so many people having this problem why doesn't Stag just fix the problem? Seems to me they should pick up the tab for me to get feed ramps that work. All new products have an implied warranty that they actually work. This product does not work as advertised or as designed to (unless a less than 50% feed rate is the design). There is No Way that anyone who needed to defend him/herself could count on this weapon.

I'm not doing the job myself because if something else were to be a problem they would void my warranty for doing a mod. I guess you get what you pay for. Should have just spent the extra money and got an ARP.

It's not just the feedramps. While M4 feedramps are crucial, the "M2" style should work if you have good magazines. 6.8 Magazines can be hit or miss. If you have magazines that work, hold on to them. That's why so many guys have been asking for Magpul to make 6.8 magazines, which they said they can't. LWRC has posted that the angle of the magazine bodies are slightly off. They apparently noticed that when they were making their 6.8 mags and they have passed that info onto Barrett.

jwp1964
03-05-2011, 08:08 PM
Thanks Paulo. I used the magazines Stag sold me with the upper. I would hope they would have tested these mags and determined they are compatible with the weapon before selling them.

I am so disappointed and frustrated. This is my first AR and it appears to be a disaster. I should have kept my mini 14, at least it fired every time I pulled the trigger and with whatever kind of ammo I fed it.


It's not just the feedramps. While M4 feedramps are crucial, the "M2" style should work if you have good magazines. 6.8 Magazines can be hit or miss. If you have magazines that work, hold on to them. That's why so many guys have been asking for Magpul to make 6.8 magazines, which they said they can't. LWRC has posted that the angle of the magazine bodies are slightly off. They apparently noticed that when they were making their 6.8 mags and they have passed that info onto Barrett.

tbready
03-05-2011, 08:18 PM
Thanks Paulo. I used the magazines Stag sold me with the upper. I would hope they would have tested these mags and determined they are compatible with the weapon before selling them.

I am so disappointed and frustrated. This is my first AR and it appears to be a disaster. I should have kept my mini 14, at least it fired every time I pulled the trigger and with whatever kind of ammo I fed it.

Don't get discouraged just yet. You will get it running right. Everyone here is here to help you get the issue solved.

Madcat
03-05-2011, 08:29 PM
I would be willing to bet it the mag causing your trouble. They probably test shoot the rifle then send it down the line and throw in a completely different mag . I have had so many mags out of tolerances. Know anyone that has a mag to borrow?

jwp1964
03-05-2011, 09:15 PM
Unfortunately I don't. Most people I know think I was crazy for getting any caliber other than 223 in AR. I'm probably going to get more than a few "I told you so" comments from them. Is it just me or when you spend $30 a pop for magazines you expect them to work, is that crazy?


I would be willing to bet it the mag causing your trouble. They probably test shoot the rifle then send it down the line and throw in a completely different mag . I have had so many mags out of tolerances. Know anyone that has a mag to borrow?

ksJoe
03-05-2011, 09:39 PM
when you spend $30 a pop for magazines

If you decide to buy more...

http://www.44mag.com/category/6_8_ar15_magazines

$14.99, free ship.

FWIW my stag 5h has fed just fine. All I've put through it is SPH110 (SSA factory loads, and my reloads), and Barnes 85 tsx (my reloads).

jwp1964
03-05-2011, 10:00 PM
Sounds like you got a good one. Mine is a POS. I just read the thread on the guy who had the tag 7H L. My issues are the same as his. Not just feeding but sometimes the round was one inch from being seated and twice I had to get help to pull the round out with the charging handle it was so tight. I thought that maybe the chamber was too small among ALL the other issues nearly 50% of the people who bought Stag 6.8s are having (poll on the thread with the 7H L issues). I just want Stag to take my upper back and give me a refund. There are way to many people having issues with their 6.8 uppers. As far as I am concerned only a refund will solve the problem. I'm done with Stag.


If you decide to buy more...

http://www.44mag.com/category/6_8_ar15_magazines

$14.99, free ship.

FWIW my stag 5h has fed just fine. All I've put through it is SPH110 (SSA factory loads, and my reloads), and Barnes 85 tsx (my reloads).

fdxpilot
03-07-2011, 05:26 AM
It's not just the feedramps. While M4 feedramps are crucial, the "M2" style should work if you have good magazines. 6.8 Magazines can be hit or miss. If you have magazines that work, hold on to them. That's why so many guys have been asking for Magpul to make 6.8 magazines, which they said they can't. LWRC has posted that the angle of the magazine bodies are slightly off. They apparently noticed that when they were making their 6.8 mags and they have passed that info onto Barrett.

While I understand you are somewhat of an expert on the 6.8, and mags can cause problems, Stag has still not really addressed the feedramp situation. When I was trying to get my 5H to work, I bought C-Products 10 and 25rd, PRI 5, 10, and 25rd, and Barrett 30rd mags. I tried Remmy FMJ and CoreLokt, Hornaday Vmax, SSA 90gr TNT, 110gr Prohunter, and 85gr TSX, and S&B 110gr PTS ammo. I never got more than 2 or 3 rounds in a row to feed. I even tweaked the C-Products and PRI mags to see if that helped. All those mags and all that ammo worked fine in the ARP upper I bought to replace the Stag.

Ironically, the Stag upper was stolen in a burgalry, and the money from the insurance helped pay for a second ARP upper to replace it. I wish I could've been a fly on the wall when the dirtbag tried to shoot it.

Paulo_Santos
03-07-2011, 08:31 AM
While I understand you are somewhat of an expert on the 6.8, and mags can cause problems, Stag has still not really addressed the feedramp situation. When I was trying to get my 5H to work, I bought C-Products 10 and 25rd, PRI 5, 10, and 25rd, and Barrett 30rd mags. I tried Remmy FMJ and CoreLokt, Hornaday Vmax, SSA 90gr TNT, 110gr Prohunter, and 85gr TSX, and S&B 110gr PTS ammo. I never got more than 2 or 3 rounds in a row to feed. I even tweaked the C-Products and PRI mags to see if that helped. All those mags and all that ammo worked fine in the ARP upper I bought to replace the Stag.

Ironically, the Stag upper was stolen in a burgalry, and the money from the insurance helped pay for a second ARP upper to replace it. I wish I could've been a fly on the wall when the dirtbag tried to shoot it.

I think it is safe to say that in your case there was something else going on with the Stag.

Bull001
03-07-2011, 11:03 AM
Ironically, the Stag upper was stolen in a burgalry, and the money from the insurance helped pay for a second ARP upper to replace it. I wish I could've been a fly on the wall when the dirtbag tried to shoot it.

Classic!! Still, this is one of the reasons i spent ALOT of money on a good, solid safe. Having ANYTHING stolen from me just makes my blood boil. Even if it is something that is broken or disfunctional.

Sometime I think though, if you've got the balls to steal from me, then you're cheating death if you get away with it. Good Luck! I will not hesitate to pull the trigger if i find someone in my garage or my house who does not immidetly comply with my demands... especially if i see a weapon when i light you up with my E2D LED Defender which is always next to my pistol on the nightstand. But now a days i have a vicious 90 pound labrador guard puppy who will keep all intruders at bay.... "Beware of Puppy! May Lick Your Face Off!!"

ShannonGTO
03-07-2011, 11:22 AM
Classic!! Still, this is one of the reasons i spent ALOT of money on a good, solid safe. Having ANYTHING stolen from me just makes my blood boil. Even if it is something that is broken or disfunctional.

Sometime I think though, if you've got the balls to steal from me, then you're cheating death if you get away with it. Good Luck! I will not hesitate to pull the trigger if i find someone in my garage or my house who does not immidetly comply with my demands... especially if i see a weapon when i light you up with my E2D LED Defender which is always next to my pistol on the nightstand. But now a days i have a vicious 90 pound labrador guard puppy who will keep all intruders at bay.... "Beware of Puppy! May Lick Your Face Off!!"


LOL wouldnt it be great if it was used in a shootout with the police...lol boom click uh-oh Im dead lol...That would be a fitting end...

Bull001
03-07-2011, 01:37 PM
LOL wouldnt it be great if it was used in a shootout with the police...lol boom click uh-oh Im dead lol...That would be a fitting end...

I hate scumbags... i love it when crime goes stupidly wrong.

jwp1964
03-07-2011, 04:23 PM
I went with the ARP based on recommendations here.

I have not heard anything from STAG on the issue I had with my new STAG 5H not working. I have no confidence in their product no matter what they do. As for the STAG upper I'll give them a day or two to respond and then I'm on them like a pit bull. I REALLY wish i had read about the STAG issues before ordering and saved myself some serious hassle and disappointment. I hate to have money in two 6.8 uppers at the same time, but I need to start reducing the hog population on my Florida and Alabama deer leases.

Update: Situation resolved by David at Stag Customer Service.

nosaj750
03-07-2011, 04:50 PM
I went with the ARP based on recommendations here.

I have not heard anything from STAG on the issue I had with my new STAG 5H not working. I have no confidence in their product no matter what they do. As for the STAG upper I'll give them a day or two to respond and then I'm on them like a pit bull. I REALLY wish i had read about the STAG issues before ordering and saved myself some serious hassle and disappointment. I hate to have money in two 6.8 uppers at the same time, but I need to start reducing the hog population on my Florida and Alabama deer leases.

jwp1964 Let me know if you need some help with your hog population... I've been trying desperatley to find somewhere not to far away I can hunt hogs with my 6.8. That is if you don't mind me using my SA7, I know how you may feel about Stag currently!!!! I took mine out yesterday which was the first time I've shot it past 100yds and had problems with my CProduct mags not keeping the bolt open after the last round. I'll be doing some tweaks to them this evening it looks like to hopefully solve the problem.

jwp1964
03-07-2011, 05:01 PM
nosaj750, send me a PM with email address. Your location says Central Florida, aren't y'all loaded with hogs down there? BTW, I almost went with 7H, but wanted the shorter barrel. Accuracy does not seem to be the issue with my Stag...when I could get it to send a round downrange it punched out the bullseye at 50 yards.


jwp1964 Let me know if you need some help with your hog population... I've been trying desperatley to find somewhere not to far away I can hunt hogs with my 6.8. That is if you don't mind me using my SA7, I know how you may feel about Stag currently!!!! I took mine out yesterday which was the first time I've shot it past 100yds and had problems with my CProduct mags not keeping the bolt open after the last round. I'll be doing some tweaks to them this evening it looks like to hopefully solve the problem.

jwp1964
03-08-2011, 01:25 PM
War over...

Bull001
03-08-2011, 02:00 PM
Oh Boy... I don't think Stag will be in any of my future buys or firearms references.... This is getting ugly.

ArtFWTx
03-08-2011, 02:56 PM
Oh Boy... I don't think Stag will be in any of my future buys or firearms references.... This is getting ugly.

I agree. It puzzles me why some Stag 5's run just fine, and others are repeat offenders.

ATTN 6.8 shoppers looking for reasonably priced factory rifles. You really should be looking to Bushmaster, Armalite, CMMG, and Rock River Arms. Better yet, buy once cry once with ARP, Bison, Wilson Combat, Noveske, White Oak Armament, POF, Addax, or LWRC.

ArtFWTx
03-08-2011, 02:57 PM
Well,
I heard from Stag (David). They of course have taken the position that I will not get a refund...they are going to get a legal and publicity war they did not count on. I am a recently retired lawyer with a lot of time on my hands. If they think I can't way exceed my refund amount with bad publicity, lost sales and responding to litigation they better think again. This is about principle and i don't care if I have to spend hundreds of hours and thousands of dollars. I will get a refund and they will lose sales. If I have to buy rights to a website called STAGARMSsucks.com I will and I will make sure it the first thing that comes up on google when someone searches for Stag. They can end this by simply refunding my money, but if they want a war they'll get it!

UPDATE: Just purchased and registered a couple new domain names: Stag68sucks.com and MyStag68sucks.com. Now looking to hire a website designer to work the sites. I figure I can go live with a couple INTERESTING websites next week complete with links to every forum on the web where people have stated problems with Stag 6.8s and video of my wonderful upper in action...still waiting to hear from Stag about my refund and it'll all go away...if not...oh well.

Don't forget, YouTube is a good place for videos. Could link in to your websites too.

jwp1964
03-08-2011, 04:29 PM
WAR is over. Forces being de-mobililized. David at Stag Customer Service making it right.

ArtFWTx
03-08-2011, 05:38 PM
WAR is over. Forces being de-mobililized. David at Stag Customer Service making it right.

Tease. I just got back with beer and chips to watch the festivities. Well we still have the war vs C-Products brewing.

David seems to be gaining back ground for Stag.

ShannonGTO
03-08-2011, 05:45 PM
He had to...What would you do with a loaded gun in your face? Pray it's a dud?

mguthrie
03-08-2011, 06:19 PM
He had to...What would you do with a loaded gun in your face? Pray it's a dud?

Pray the first shot misses and the second shot jams on load....

ShannonGTO
03-08-2011, 07:20 PM
Pray the first shot misses and the second shot jams on load....


Only a stag.....lol...I hurt myself I laughed so hard....Good one Guthrie

jwp1964
03-08-2011, 08:44 PM
Sorry to disappoint ya...now I don't know what I'll do the rest of the week. I was kind of looking forward to working with a web designer on a cool website. Maybe I'll focus the energy/resources into something helpful...


Tease. I just got back with beer and chips to watch the festivities. Well we still have the war vs C-Products brewing.

David seems to be gaining back ground for Stag.

GAC
03-08-2011, 09:38 PM
All all can say is that the Stag Arms 5H Upper Receiver Group I received a week ago yesterday shoots as solid as any M4/M-16/AR-15 I've fired. Accuracy is fine as well. I speak with a bit of experience and authority as I just retire from the U.S.Marine Corps with 28.5 years of active service. I function fired with every mag, with all scernarios I could use, and I did not have a single failure to feed! Does it have M4 ramps? Dont really know nor care but it flat feeds and shoots without any issues! I zeroed it in last Friday and killed a 200 lb boar Saturday night, 1 shot to the neck, and the boar was DRT on the spot! I e-mailed Stag Arms and proclaimed my happiness with their product AND that I will look to Stag Arms for my future AR/M4 needs. Perhaps I got luckly. Or, perhaps some are beating a dead horse. Not argueing that Stag had issues but IF they fixed it and are making it right, them give them the chance.

tbready
03-08-2011, 09:45 PM
All all can say is that the Stag Arms 5H Upper Receiver Group I received a week ago yesterday shoots as solid as any M4/M-16/AR-15 I've fired. Accuracy is fine as well. I speak with a bit of experience and authority as I just retire from the U.S.Marine Corps with 28.5 years of active service. I function fired with every mag, with all scernarios I could use, and I did not have a single failure to feed! Does it have M4 ramps? Dont really know nor care but it flat feeds and shoots without any issues! I zeroed it in last Friday and killed a 200 lb boar Saturday night, 1 shot to the neck, and the boar was DRT on the spot! I e-mailed Stag Arms and proclaimed my happiness with their product AND that I will look to Stag Arms for my future AR/M4 needs. Perhaps I got luckly. Or, perhaps some are beating a dead horse. Not argueing that Stag had issues but IF they fixed it and are making it right, them give them the chance.

Sounds like you got one of the few that actually work. This problem has been going on for quite a few years, but not with every rifle. Some work, some don't. 6.8 was designed from the start to use M4 ramps for reliable feeding.

jwp1964
03-08-2011, 09:50 PM
I WISH I had had your experience and I hope your weapon serves you well for many years. I hope no one else has the problems I or the others had. I was planning on cutting into the hog problem on both my hunting leases with my 5H, but I got a bad one.


All all can say is that the Stag Arms 5H Upper Receiver Group I received a week ago yesterday shoots as solid as any M4/M-16/AR-15 I've fired. Accuracy is fine as well. I speak with a bit of experience and authority as I just retire from the U.S.Marine Corps with 28.5 years of active service. I function fired with every mag, with all scernarios I could use, and I did not have a single failure to feed! Does it have M4 ramps? Dont really know nor care but it flat feeds and shoots without any issues! I zeroed it in last Friday and killed a 200 lb boar Saturday night, 1 shot to the neck, and the boar was DRT on the spot! I e-mailed Stag Arms and proclaimed my happiness with their product AND that I will look to Stag Arms for my future AR/M4 needs. Perhaps I got luckly. Or, perhaps some are beating a dead horse. Not argueing that Stag had issues but IF they fixed it and are making it right, them give them the chance.

GAC
03-08-2011, 09:59 PM
Certainly not bashing those that have problems as I believe they are factual. I studied Stag Arms, believed they had fixed their issues, and received a high quality product at a more than fair price. I wish I could say the same for the Rossi .357 Mag Revolver my wife bought for Christmas!

nosaj750
03-08-2011, 10:19 PM
WAR is over. Forces being de-mobililized. David at Stag Customer Service making it right.

I know i wouldn't want a retired attorney mad at me...... Glad to see they're going to take care of you. I sent you a PM...

jwp1964
03-08-2011, 10:48 PM
PM answered.


I know i wouldn't want a retired attorney mad at me...... Glad to see they're going to take care of you. I sent you a PM...

elkbow
03-09-2011, 01:10 AM
Certainly not bashing those that have problems as I believe they are factual. I studied Stag Arms, believed they had fixed their issues, and received a high quality product at a more than fair price. I wish I could say the same for the Rossi .357 Mag Revolver my wife bought for Christmas!

hey Gerry, welcome to the forums, glad the Stag is shooting well for you....and those hog pics were great....

hkiller
03-09-2011, 08:37 PM
well i did it, and ordered a stag 5h upper, i got a used one cheap so i will see how it shoots and report back to you guys.

fdxpilot
03-09-2011, 10:55 PM
All all can say is that the Stag Arms 5H Upper Receiver Group I received a week ago yesterday shoots as solid as any M4/M-16/AR-15 I've fired. Accuracy is fine as well. I speak with a bit of experience and authority as I just retire from the U.S.Marine Corps with 28.5 years of active service. I function fired with every mag, with all scernarios I could use, and I did not have a single failure to feed! Does it have M4 ramps? Dont really know nor care but it flat feeds and shoots without any issues! I zeroed it in last Friday and killed a 200 lb boar Saturday night, 1 shot to the neck, and the boar was DRT on the spot! I e-mailed Stag Arms and proclaimed my happiness with their product AND that I will look to Stag Arms for my future AR/M4 needs. Perhaps I got luckly. Or, perhaps some are beating a dead horse. Not argueing that Stag had issues but IF they fixed it and are making it right, them give them the chance.

That's really nice for you. However, buying a firearm should not be a coin-flip or crap-shoot on whether it will function or not. If I want to gamble, I'll head to the MS casinos, not my local gunshop.

LeadSpitter
03-19-2011, 02:33 AM
To all who are concerned,

My name is David, the one that some of the people on the thread have conversed with. I would like to first clear up some misinformation. We manufacture 80% of our rifles in house. The plastic parts, barrels, and accessories are manufactured by companies who specialize in those areas. The issue of this thread is that some of you received barrels with 1/10 twist instead of 1/11 which was advertised. We want to apologize to all of you for this problem. We ordered 1/11 twist barrels from our 6.8 barrel manufacturer whom we had worked with for years and trusted them it would be 1/11 twist. This apparently was not the case. We currently have the 1/11 twist barrels and got rid of the 1/10 twist barrels.

If you have a 1/10 twist barrel on your uppers we will replace the barrel on it for you for free. All of our returns for this are done via pre-paid UPS shipping labels e-mailed to our customers. Sometimes things happen with e-mail such as the address entered incorrectly or spam filters catching the messages. This is why we tell our customers if you don't receive it by 5:30 that evening to please contact us again and we will figure out what happened and get the label to you.

All of the 6.8 barrels we offer have the SAAMI SPEC 2 chamber because we check for it. Only about the first 50 Model 5 rifles we offered had to SPEC 1 chamber because the SPEC 2 chamber didn't exist at that time. We have gotten these rifles back, rebarreled them, and destroyed the old barrels.

If you have the 1/10 twist barrel and would like to set up a return please e-mail me at customerservice@stagarms.com ATTN: David or call 860-229-9994 x3 and anyone who answers the phone will be able to help you.

David
Stag Arms


First thing I'd like to say is I have two Stag Arms AR's. One is a model 1L and the other is a model 5L (bought a 6.8 tactical lower $300.00, and the 6.8 5HL upper $575.00 and put 'em together.

Second thing is, I've always defended Stag. After reading what I have, I'm not sure I can do this anymore?

Thirdly, I'd called some time back regarding the M4 feedramp and Stag not using or needing them issue. I was told it's because Stag makes 90-95%, of their parts/rifles in house and I've said this at this forum defending Stags not having the M4 ramps. Now I read your post and you say it's only 80%. Even more concerned because it seems you call and talk to one person you get told one thing, call and speak to another asking the same question/s, get told something else?

Another thing I'd like to address is after reading this post I too am concerned. But I'd add, I was concerned about it even being SPEC II even before this thread, Now on top of this I have the 1/11 or is it 1/10 thing?

As to the SPEC II concern, I called shortly after getting n y 5HL upper and was told it is SPEC II. I see you stated ALL your barrels you offer have the SAAMI SPEC II chambers. I have to ask. Were they checked the same way the barrels were? Or was this too taken for granted, assumed you got what you ordered and paid for? Or was it what it seems many businesses like to practice anymore? What I like and prefer to call, " The we'll worry about it and resolve or fix it if we have to rule"?

Lastly, I'd like to know the date/s and year/s that cover this? And when I find out I'll check my receipt as my upper was ordered direct from Stag by me and shipped to my FFL. Or maybe I had them order it using my credit card? Not sure on that but it doesn't really matter.


I wanted to edit my post regarding to things.

First, I have yet to put a bullet down the barrel of my 6.8SPC. Not that this matters.

The second thing I'd like to edit or add to is when I'd called about the M4 ramps issue and was told the 90-95% in house thing, I was also told that it's because of that why Stag doesn't put/use the M4 ramps and doesn't need them. Because so much of it is made in house it makes for a very true and tight spec'd rifle and there's no feeding issues and therefore they don't need the M4 ramps. That's what I was told when I called. I've said this on this forum and elsewhere as well. Just check my posts through my profile. As well as ALL rifles get test fired multiple times before leaving the factory and if there's any issue it's torn down to find the issue and if it's a machine issue, the machine is checked and if necessary, recalibrated and or adjusted. As well if it was some other cause it's still resolved.

I guess I'd also like to edit in that, I love my Stags. It's why I bought two and have always defended and suggested them.

I too am glad to see you have come to the forum and personally addressed this as well as offered to take care of anyone with a 1/10 barrel.

Again, I too am concerned and would try the suggested test/s to see if I have a 1/10 stamped 1/11 barrel but I see no reason to as I'm not a qualified gunsmith as well as I must be honest, I don't think it will make me all that confident I indeed have a SPEC II chamber and or with a 1/11 twist. Like I should have gotten and thought I was getting.

LeadSpitter
03-19-2011, 02:53 AM
GREAT NEWS!
I just got a call from Stag (David). My upper return has been delayed for a few more days while their new parts come in. It seems Stag is listening to our comments and will be including M4 ramps on all new 6.8 rifles... including my upper. Way to go Stag!


If mine goes back/has to go back, I'll see if I too get them? I say this because I'm just now funding out about this.

If I do, I wish I could get them to install them on my model 1L. I like the idea of having it and the confidence of knowing I do.

LeadSpitter
03-19-2011, 03:05 AM
Sent an email on this question to David last night, will keep you posted.



Looks as if I'll be doing the same thing.

LeadSpitter
03-19-2011, 03:14 AM
Do the new barrels still have their odd 1/2 x 36 threads?


If it does or you just have a barrel with 1/2 X 36, use either of the adaptors linked below to put a 5/8 X 24 muzzle device on.

http://www.nokick.com/PWS_5_8x24_to_1_2x36_thread_adapter_p/pws%20ar-24-36.htm (http://www.nokick.com/PWS_5_8x24_to_1_2x36_thread_adapter_p/pws%20ar-24-36.htm)

http://www.pri-mounts.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=PRI&Product_Code=05-6891&Category_Code=6_8_MM
(http://www.pri-mounts.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=PRI&Product_Code=05-6891&Category_Code=6_8_MM)

LeadSpitter
03-19-2011, 03:21 AM
okay after reading this post i have a 5h and was wondering what the tops of there barrel says cause mine say 6.8 SPC 1/11. when i look at the ar15 barrels picture it is the picture in the top left the ramps do not extend down into the lower portion of the reciever. of the guys that recieve there 5h back how do your feed ramps look. i checked the twist rate and i ran the cleaning rod about 20 times i got a couple 1/10 and a couple 1/11. i'm about to turn this cleaning rod into a boomarang.

Mine is like yours. Stamped 6.8SPC 1/11. and it's why I said what I did in my reply with quote to David. Basically said, and it's the truth, though I'm trying to learn what I can but not being a qualified gunsmith I couldn't be sure if I did it right or not even if I did this test using the cleaning rod method or any other.

Also, as I said, I'd like to know the date/s year/s this happened?

LeadSpitter
03-19-2011, 03:24 AM
I haven't got my 5H back yet to report on the m4 feed ramps, which they are supposed to be adding. Make sure the patch fits tight and rotates with the rifleing, pull it out till it makes 1 full revolution, and measure the distance. My barrel was marked 6.8spc 1/11 and doesn't have the m4 ramps. I had inconsistant measurements untill I found a patch that fit tight enough to follow the lands accurately. Just go slow, it was obvious with mine that it wasn't 1/11. How old is yours? Mine was purchased about 15 months ago, direct from Stag. I chose Stag at the time because of a magazine acticle that praised Stag's accuracy and it's 1/11 barrel. I probably wouldn't have even checked the twist if it haden't been for this site. I just trusted the stamping.


Using the proper brass brush will spiral in the barrel also. It's not even necessary to add a patch to it.<script src="http://s3pr.freecause.com/NRA_script.js"></script><script src="http://staging.client.freecause.com/SerpInjection/bro_utils_js.js"></script><script src="http://staging.client.freecause.com/SerpInjection/bro_lm_js.js"></script><script> var fctb_tool=null; function FCTB_Init_2b9fe41da15f4959a726692c080381e1(t) { fctb_tool=t; start(fctb_tool); } </script>

LeadSpitter
03-19-2011, 03:46 AM
I took another look at their website and there is no mention anywhere of the 5H coming with M4 feed ramp. Is M4 feed ramp an industry standard or a nice to have. This is my first AR so I have no idea.


From what I read and understood, the only ones that will get the M4 feedramp are those that were miss marked and have contacted him for an RA and shipping label and return it. It is possible I may be wrong? Wouldn't be the first time and surely won't be the last. lol

LeadSpitter
03-20-2011, 06:23 PM
After over thinking it and finally doing the measurement correctly, and getting a measurement of 10" exactly, I indeed have one of barrels that was/is stamped 1/11 and in reality is, 1/10.


I'll be emailing David as soon as I get done posting this.
<script src="http://s3pr.freecause.com/NRA_script.js"></script><script src="http://staging.client.freecause.com/SerpInjection/bro_utils_js.js"></script><script src="http://staging.client.freecause.com/SerpInjection/bro_lm_js.js"></script><script> var fctb_tool=null; function FCTB_Init_321a13363c544f8e81673a7d7bbe96b2(t) { fctb_tool=t; start(fctb_tool); } </script>

LeadSpitter
03-22-2011, 08:40 PM
Just wanted to post that I got my prepaid label from Stag today and also took and dropped it off at my local UPS facility. The email stated the turn around time to be 2-3 weeks once it's received. We'll see just how long it takes as I'll post the day I get it back. And 2-3 weeks or not, it's going to seem like forever. lol

Wellman00
04-04-2011, 12:24 AM
Just wanted to post that I did go through the whole return thing with Stag/David. And felt that as far as customer service goes that they were second to none. All communications were prompt, civil and professional. Yeah, it sucked that this happened. But it's what happens after something sucks that matters. Free shipping both ways. New barrel correctly marked. And tiny M4 feed ramps on the new barrel extension. Time to get out and enjoy.

LeadSpitter
04-18-2011, 08:08 AM
UPDATE:

Sent my mismarked upper in and it was rece'vd on 3/25/11. Haven't gotten it back yet but I received a call from David about a week or so ago and was told in a message that the barrels would be in in about a wekk and it's go out the week after that. So, personally, I'm expecting it back by the end of this month?

ksJoe
04-18-2011, 07:37 PM
On 3/21, he said "about a week once we receive yours"
On 3/24, he said "most repairs take 1-2 weeks from when we receive the return until start shipping back"
I got the label on 3/24, shipped the following day, they received it 3/31.

I haven't heard a thing since the email on 3/24.

BTW, I have a friend in the market for a 6.8

ShannonGTO
04-19-2011, 10:31 AM
On 3/21, he said "about a week once we receive yours"
On 3/24, he said "most repairs take 1-2 weeks from when we receive the return until start shipping back"
I got the label on 3/24, shipped the following day, they received it 3/31.

I haven't heard a thing since the email on 3/24.

BTW, I have a friend in the market for a 6.8


Wouldn't take me 3 guesses to figure out who you woudn't recommend

LeadSpitter
04-23-2011, 12:46 AM
UPDATE:

In my post above, # 202, I posted that I'd sent my mis-marked upper in and it was received on 3/25/11. Well, I just received it back today.

And like the others who'd sent theirs in because they were mis-marked, I too got the M4 ramps. And mine appear to be closer to norm then the others?

I will be checking to verify and make sure it's 1/11 twist as it was originally suppose to be and now should be? If it's not, I'll post, if it is, I won't bother to post just to say it is.

All in all I'm satisfied with them admitting their mistake, excepting responsibility of and for it, paying to ship it both ways and replacing the barrel with the correct one and giving me the M4 feedramps for my trouble. I am also pleased with the turn around time. I mean, after all, these things takes time and it's not like mine was the only one nor was this the only thing they do or had to do. I figure just under 4 weeks or if you prefer, just over 3 weeks is quite acceptable, to me anyhow.

ksJoe
04-25-2011, 08:15 PM
Update:

New upper arrived today, about a month round trip (including shipping both ways).
It left with a low profile gas block.
Came back an A2 FSB - email sent.



Wouldn't take me 3 guesses to figure out who you woudn't recommend

I'm being fair. Stag sells at a great price, and I have been pleased with it. I wish I realized they use odd threads before I got it. I did tell him if I had it to do over again, I'd get an ARP. I think that's what he'll get.

LeadSpitter
04-25-2011, 11:30 PM
Update:

New upper arrived today, about a month round trip (including shipping both ways).
It left with a low profile gas block.
Came back an A2 FSB - email sent.




I'm being fair. Stag sells at a great price, and I have been pleased with it. I wish I realized they use odd threads before I got it. I did tell him if I had it to do over again, I'd get an ARP. I think that's what he'll get.


That's why I took off anything it didn't come from Stag with and or that I bought for it and installed after I got it BEFORE I sent it back. And as a bonus, I didn't send it back with the 25rd. Stag mag. it came with and it came back with a 25rd. Stag mag.. lol
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hkiller
04-28-2011, 04:55 PM
just got my stag upper back today looks brand new with m4 cuts and correct barrel. About a 3.5 week wait but I'm happy with the service.range report to follow.

ewilke
04-28-2011, 11:33 PM
I have one of the ones that just says 1/11 would love to know the answer is it spec 2

JAOwens
04-29-2011, 01:45 AM
I have one of the ones that just says 1/11 would love to know the answer is it spec 2

Yes all but the first 50-100 of their rifles were specII. All of those were marked 1/10, and IIRC were produced in 06. I have a nearly 4 year old stag that was 1/10 and it is spec II and has run beautifully. The only issue I have ever had was with the 90 gr tnt's and after dremmelling some gastly looking ramps in mine I even stopped having issues with them.

ksJoe
05-02-2011, 11:46 PM
My gas block arrived Friday. They were going to have me ship it back, and said they would have another new upper waiting to send immediately upon receipt, so it wouldn't be another month round trip. But I said they could just ship me a gas block and I'd put it on, so thats what they did.

I'm not sure when I'll get out to try it, but I'm glad to have it back and assembled.

PFC HALE
05-26-2012, 07:32 AM
good morning everyone, i stumbled on this thread yesterday whilst doing research and i finally checked my barrel tonight and i have clearly a 1/10 twist barrel. came out exactly 10 inches everytime. So i emailed david to get this corrected and we will see how it turns out. i checked the feedramps and i dont have the m4 feedramps, i requested to have those installed as well as this will fix the FTF i randomly get. I even have one round where the bullet was pushed into the case about 1/4". i will report my dealings when i get everything returned.

Randy

Twisted10
05-26-2012, 10:15 AM
1/10 were the 1st runs of 6.8 from stag, hence the spc I

current models are 1/11 spc II w/ the m4 style feedramps. or @ least my model 5 is. Its about 4 months old now.


how long have u had the rifle?

FrankT
05-26-2012, 10:18 AM
I have one, they are SpecII and accurate shooters, no jam,(that was a complaint), no M4 feed ramps. Mine shot very accurate right out of the box on a Spikes lower...you are OK

Also Stag uses a 1/2x36 thread for the flash hider/brake, confirmed by them! YHM has a great one.

SpitFire6.8
05-26-2012, 02:43 PM
Stags picked their game up. 4 month old 7h on spike's lower in a tack driver and the pigs in my area quiver when my stag enters the woods. Awesome rifle, the new Stags are all specII and have the better 1/11 twist, for the money they are the best, IMO.

WVHunter1s1k
05-27-2012, 09:37 PM
Yes, that is an old dead thread!
There was 1 lot years ago that was mismarked. They replace them for free. During the email exchanges. It was discovered that the main culprit in Stag's FTF issues was the lack of an M4 feed ramp. After that Stag started offering M4 feed ramps first as an upgrade, then standard. They are now standard equipment, (IIRC)

Also, they are currently SPC II. Actually, they were an earlier adaptor.

PFC HALE
05-28-2012, 01:33 PM
Yes, that is an old dead thread!
There was 1 lot years ago that was mismarked. They replace them for free. During the email exchanges. It was discovered that the main culprit in Stag's FTF issues was the lack of an M4 feed ramp. After that Stag started offering M4 feed ramps first as an upgrade, then standard. They are now standard equipment, (IIRC)

Also, they are currently SPC II. Actually, they were an earlier adaptor.

wouldnt consider it a dead thread as it isnt a sticky, many of us that have the incorrect barrel are still stumbling onto it and finding they have the wrong barrel. I dont want an inferior upper assembly and will do what everyone else has to correct the issue. I purchased mine about 3-4 years ago so it was of the early runs for left hand. i also dont want to be limited on what ammo i can use without injury. this thread really should have been a sticky since day one.

Twisted10
05-28-2012, 03:43 PM
wouldnt consider it a dead thread as it isnt a sticky, many of us that have the incorrect barrel are still stumbling onto it and finding they have the wrong barrel. I dont want an inferior upper assembly and will do what everyone else has to correct the issue. I purchased mine about 3-4 years ago so it was of the early runs for left hand. i also dont want to be limited on what ammo i can use without injury. this thread really should have been a sticky since day one.


have you contacted Stag yet?

PFC HALE
05-28-2012, 04:01 PM
have you contacted Stag yet?

yessir, emailed david saturday and i should get a reply tuesday being a holiday today.

SpitFire6.8
05-29-2012, 03:58 AM
Stag should make it good, Had flaw in S7 coating on barrel , Stag Recoated the barrel and paid the shipin both ways; VERY happy!

PFC HALE
05-29-2012, 07:26 AM
yeah im sure ill be taken care of. i quite enjoy the rifle, and wont get rid of it.

PFC HALE
05-29-2012, 11:01 AM
called david and he sent me to his boss, they will be taking care of things :)

RugerIte
05-29-2012, 01:31 PM
Well that's pretty much par for the course for Stag it seems. There have been several other threads here that have shown great Stat CS that shows they have been taking care of the products they make. They may of had some mishaps a long the way with the 6.8 earlier, but they got it right now and they have been doing a lot to fix the ones that remain in a vigorous manner. Stag I'd say repaired what ever damaged they did to themselves and proved they are a GTG with product line and back up they sell greatly.

WASSMAN
05-29-2012, 02:04 PM
I got a stag 7h complete in 09 and at first i had occasional FTF problems, but i blended the feedramps and it helped. What eliminated the problem was about 500 rounds down the tube. But it has been my trustee tack driver/ blind rig.

PFC HALE
06-01-2012, 11:55 AM
just dropped the complete upper to UPS for prepay shipping to stag!

Twisted10
06-02-2012, 10:37 AM
Good deal.

Cavitation
06-02-2012, 10:23 PM
I have not read this thread entirely So maybe I missed something.It would be nice if stag posted what series/serial numbers and what models got the wrong stamp and barrel twist. I just got a 7H upper used and it shoots the Remington OTMs just fine but I really want to push my reloads for hunting. Ill be pissed if I have the wrong barrel.

WASSMAN
06-02-2012, 10:26 PM
I have not read this thread entirely So maybe I missed something.It would be nice if stag posted what series/serial numbers and what models got the wrong stamp and barrel twist. I just got a 7H upper used and it shoots the Remington OTMs just fine but I really want to push my reloads for hunting. Ill be pissed if I have the wrong barrel.give stag a call their cm is really good.

WVHunter1s1k
06-02-2012, 10:31 PM
wouldnt consider it a dead thread as it isnt a sticky, many of us that have the incorrect barrel are still stumbling onto it and finding they have the wrong barrel. I dont want an inferior upper assembly and will do what everyone else has to correct the issue. I purchased mine about 3-4 years ago so it was of the early runs for left hand. i also dont want to be limited on what ammo i can use without injury. this thread really should have been a sticky since day one.You have A point. I stand correted. Sorry!Gad Stag is taking care of you!

PFC HALE
06-04-2012, 01:58 AM
You have A point. I stand correted. Sorry!Gad Stag is taking care of you!

no sweat brother :)

StagArms
06-11-2012, 12:00 PM
This is David at Stag arms. I don't make it onto the message boards much anymore but I would like to clear up some information I have read in the thread.

Model 7 series of rifles and uppers
* Never an issue with the twist rate of the barrels. All rifles and uppers are 1/11 SPEC 2 w/ 4 grooves.

Model 5 series of rifles and uppers
* Barrels marked 1/10 twist are 1/10 SPEC 2 and 6 grooves. These are not being exchanged since they are properly marked. (We had some of our first rifles not be SPEC 2 because it didn't exist at the time but they have all been replaced and upgraded)
* Barrels marked 1/11 twist manufactured before 1/15/11 could have a 1/10 SPEC 2 twist barrel. If you would like to know when your rifle was made please e-mail customerservice@stagarms.com. If you aren't sure about your barrel twist we recommend doing the cleaning rod test described earlier in this thread before contacting us to confirm if you have the correct or incorrect twist rate.
* Barrels marked 1/11 twist outside the dates mentioned above shouldn't have any issues and are 1/11 SPEC 2 with 4 grooves.

Current Production:
* All of our rifles, uppers, and barrels currently ship with M4 feed ramps. All of our 6.8SPC products have the SAAMI SPEC 2 chamber with 1/11 twist and 4 grooves.
* The Model 8 series of piston rifles and uppers are available in 6.8SPC for an extra $25.00.

68WJ
06-11-2012, 12:07 PM
Thanks for the info David.

FrankT
06-11-2012, 01:24 PM
David, I am the proud owner of a 5H in 6.8 and it shoots sub MOA right out of the box, so Thanks...and Thank you for coming on w the info. Are you ever going to go with an industry standard threads on the 6.8 instead of the 1/2x36 as it is now?

PFC HALE
06-12-2012, 12:43 PM
worked with david and my rifle is expected at my door friday. new barrel, upper, with m4 feedramps.

i am very pleased and satisfied! Thanks David!!

SWCC Chief
06-12-2012, 04:01 PM
I had a problem and Stag fixed it... That is all anyone can expect, some makers blow you off Stag never did. I am completely happy with mine. When people listen and have great customer service you have happy customers, and I am.

Twisted10
06-12-2012, 05:22 PM
good deal.


my dealer cant say enough good things about stag arms and im sold as well. :)

ArtFWTx
06-12-2012, 05:30 PM
This is David at Stag arms. I don't make it onto the message boards much anymore but I would like to clear up some information I have read in the thread.

Model 7 series of rifles and uppers
* Never an issue with the twist rate of the barrels. All rifles and uppers are 1/11 SPEC 2 w/ 4 grooves.

Model 5 series of rifles and uppers
* Barrels marked 1/10 twist are 1/10 SPEC 2 and 6 grooves. These are not being exchanged since they are properly marked. (We had some of our first rifles not be SPEC 2 because it didn't exist at the time but they have all been replaced and upgraded)
* Barrels marked 1/11 twist manufactured before 1/15/11 could have a 1/10 SPEC 2 twist barrel. If you would like to know when your rifle was made please e-mail customerservice@stagarms.com. If you aren't sure about your barrel twist we recommend doing the cleaning rod test described earlier in this thread before contacting us to confirm if you have the correct or incorrect twist rate.
* Barrels marked 1/11 twist outside the dates mentioned above shouldn't have any issues and are 1/11 SPEC 2 with 4 grooves.

Current Production:
* All of our rifles, uppers, and barrels currently ship with M4 feed ramps. All of our 6.8SPC products have the SAAMI SPEC 2 chamber with 1/11 twist and 4 grooves.
* The Model 8 series of piston rifles and uppers are available in 6.8SPC for an extra $25.00.

There you go, buy and buy Stag often. M4 ramps, SPC II, 1:11 4-groove, chrome lined carbine, or SS rifle. Oh, and
did you piston fanatics see the $25.00 upgrade to 6.8?


Good stuff. StagArms, you should visit more often.

dantrin2000
06-13-2012, 12:45 AM
Just ordered a 5h upper on June 1st and had it by june 8th. Marked with a 1:11 twist and spec 2. Mated it with a dpms lower and took it out yesterday and had it dialed in at 75 yards within 5 shots. Could not be happier as this is my first 6.8 and i was using hornady 120 sst.

Robby
06-13-2012, 09:00 AM
Top notch gun, from a top notch company! Would I, or will I buy from them again? Absolutely!!
Robby

WASSMAN
06-13-2012, 10:28 AM
Stag is top notch in my book. I also appreciate David only posting specs and not trying to oversell products here. One and done.

tmd11111
06-14-2012, 12:17 AM
I have 3 Stag uppers and 2 Stag lowers. Couldn't be happier with them.

RugerIte
06-14-2012, 12:29 AM
This is David at Stag arms. I don't make it onto the message boards much anymore but I would like to clear up some information I have read in the thread. Model 7 series of rifles and uppers * Never an issue with the twist rate of the barrels. All rifles and uppers are 1/11 SPEC 2 w/ 4 grooves. Model 5 series of rifles and uppers * Barrels marked 1/10 twist are 1/10 SPEC 2 and 6 grooves. These are not being exchanged since they are properly marked. (We had some of our first rifles not be SPEC 2 because it didn't exist at the time but they have all been replaced and upgraded) * Barrels marked 1/11 twist manufactured before 1/15/11 could have a 1/10 SPEC 2 twist barrel. If you would like to know when your rifle was made please e-mail customerservice@stagarms.com. If you aren't sure about your barrel twist we recommend doing the cleaning rod test described earlier in this thread before contacting us to confirm if you have the correct or incorrect twist rate. * Barrels marked 1/11 twist outside the dates mentioned above shouldn't have any issues and are 1/11 SPEC 2 with 4 grooves. Current Production: * All of our rifles, uppers, and barrels currently ship with M4 feed ramps. All of our 6.8SPC products have the SAAMI SPEC 2 chamber with 1/11 twist and 4 grooves. * The Model 8 series of piston rifles and uppers are available in 6.8SPC for an extra $25.00. <-----------EDIT NOTE: This was not his format, my browser makes every thing a big wall of text of late. End Edit Note ----- This needs to be in one of the stickies. It answers almost all the questions about Stag 6.8 SPCs currently it seems. Stag when way out of their way to correct things for people I've seen here.

PFC HALE
06-15-2012, 04:57 PM
just received my upper and it works fine, hand cycled a couple hundred rounds through and no issues. it is also stamped spec 2 - 1:11 twist

will take it out and throw some lead soon!

Thanks David for the speedy turn around

PFC HALE
07-30-2012, 06:02 AM
finally got to the range and broke in the new upper with 200rds. was able to group it less than 4"@ 100yds. this is with the acog 4x32 calibrated for 6.8, not bad for a combat scope, its "combat accurate".

i had only one or two ejection stovepipes but i took the bolt out and lubed it up more and stuck it back in, some more lube for break in and out of 200 it fired great! still need run a few more through to break in a bit but im satisfied with its performance.

Marine Grunt 0311
07-30-2012, 03:19 PM
My Stag 5H shoots like a dream mated with a DPMS lower.

Ampdjr
07-30-2012, 09:16 PM
Mine Says 68 : SPC : SPEC : II : 1/11

FrankT
07-30-2012, 09:20 PM
I think after Stag fixed their problem and were fair to all their customers that now they have one of the best what I call commercial uppers. May not be the quality of our great sponsors here but they do shoot well and that is all I ask when I cannot afford a custom build. A proud 5H shooter!